Obama defaults on Federal Lawsuit Jeopardizes Presidential..

[dsheinem]

and since when did believing in the constituion and civil liberites become such a radical idea??? ...if believeing in the constituition the way it was intended, or believing in the civil liberties it laid out makes me radical, then yes Sir I am.

In saying that liberals view the constitution is a living document, I didn't mean to suggest that means it is all up for grabs. In other words, I don't approve of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Generally, the democratic party has fought for extending civil liberties, not retracting them. And while they have been complicit in passing through stuff like the Patriot Act (mostly for the reasons Ack suggested), they have caught a lot of flack for it from many of their constituents.

As far as "founders' intent," there is plenty of evidence to suggest that many framers intended frequent revisiting/revising of the document. One need only look at the history of amendments to see that this has been necessary. That said, traditionally it was conservative parties that fought pretty hard against changes/additions on philosophical grounds.

[disorderlyvision]

And it would seem we ain't the only angry side, either.

I just KNEW this sounded fishy from the get go: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/24/ ... index.html

yeah, i heard about it being fake yesterday, but i never paid much attention to it in the first place. even if it were true i don't think it would have reflected poorly on the candidate (though i'm sure the media would have made a big deal about it). the candidate can't be held responsible for loony supporters. just like this being fake shouldn't have any bearing on McCain (unless his campaign was involved in some way). i think politicians and the media try to make a big deal out of crap like this because it takes our attention away from important matters that they tend not to report on.

[disorderlyvision]

and since when did believing in the constituion and civil liberites become such a radical idea??? ...if believeing in the constituition the way it was intended, or believing in the civil liberties it laid out makes me radical, then yes Sir I am.

In saying that liberals view the constitution is a living document, I didn't mean to suggest that means it is all up for grabs. In other words, I don't approve of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Generally, the democratic party has fought for extending civil liberties, not retracting them. And while they have been complicit in passing through stuff like the Patriot Act (mostly for the reasons Ack suggested), they have caught a lot of flack for it from many of their constituents.

As far as "founders' intent," there is plenty of evidence to suggest that many framers intended frequent revisiting/revising of the document. One need only look at the history of amendments to see that this has been necessary. That said, traditionally it was conservative parties that fought pretty hard against changes/additions on philosophical grounds.

perhaps...but in order for it to be a living document they wanted altered by amendments, because constitutional amendments are voted on by the states. they were not in favor of legislation being passed that was counterintuitive to the intentions of the constitution. congress these days (and presidential executive orders) pretend the constituion doesn't exist. our founding fathers had just broke free from all this BS and wrote the constitution to ensure it wouldn't happen again. well instead of adding amendments to make the constitution a "living document" they pass legislation and ignore the constitution. i am pretty sure that is not what they intended.

[Ack]

I suppose that would explain why the B was backwards, if she carved it in a mirror. I don't know how she gave herself a black eye, but apparently she has some kind of mental problems so who knows. There are other examples I could present, but ultimately disorderlyvision is correct about neither campaign being involved.

And like I said earlier, I understand the spirit behind the Patriot Act, but I see it's abusive side, so I won't defend it.

[PhilExile]

FYI:

Judge rejects Montco lawyer's bid to have Obama removed from ballot

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/2 ... allot.html

[disorderlyvision]

FYI:

Judge rejects Montco lawyer's bid to have Obama removed from ballot

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/2 ... allot.html

Thanks for the link

[MrPopo]

Wow, there's some great quotes from the judge's write up of the decision. He really tore into that guy.

[RadarScope1]

and since when did believing in the constituion and civil liberites become such a radical idea??? ...if believeing in the constituition the way it was intended, or believing in the civil liberties it laid out makes me radical, then yes Sir I am.

In saying that liberals view the constitution is a living document, I didn't mean to suggest that means it is all up for grabs. In other words, I don't approve of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Generally, the democratic party has fought for extending civil liberties, not retracting them. And while they have been complicit in passing through stuff like the Patriot Act (mostly for the reasons Ack suggested), they have caught a lot of flack for it from many of their constituents.

As far as "founders' intent," there is plenty of evidence to suggest that many framers intended frequent revisiting/revising of the document. One need only look at the history of amendments to see that this has been necessary. That said, traditionally it was conservative parties that fought pretty hard against changes/additions on philosophical grounds.

This pretty much reflects my view. The Founding Fathers called America an "experiment." The documents they framed, which the first generation of Americans approved, were by and large a promise made to future generations. Succeeding generations -- which included people like Abraham Lincoln, Susan B. Anthony, and tens of thousands of selfless soldiers, optimistic immigrants and dedicated activists -- have helped fulfill the promise. We have a ways to go. But the point is American politics is always about the future, and about progress.