Obama wins Nobel Prize

[wclem]

Their counter attack was to throw as many bodies in the way as possible.

When France feel they were touted as the strongest army in the world.

Truthfully, sounds to me like versions of history differ from country to country. What I learned runs contrary to what you learned. I guess that is how it happened. May be just a touch of anti americanism in your history books? Or maybe just pro americanism in ours. Either way it is cool, I have my point and you have yours.

Now really, I have to abandon this thread guys. It has been a blast getting everyone up in arms as to say. No hard feelings no bad thoughts.

[Mod_Man_Extreme]

Their counter attack was to throw as many bodies in the way as possible.

When France feel they were touted as the strongest army in the world.

Truthfully, sounds to me like versions of history differ from country to country. What I learned runs contrary to what you learned. I guess that is how it happened. May be just a touch of anti americanism in your history books? Or maybe just pro americanism in ours. Either way it is cool, I have my point and you have yours.

Now really, I have to abandon this thread guys. It has been a blast getting everyone up in arms as to say. No hard feelings no bad thoughts.

Let me ask though just to make sure, do you believe in the Holocaust?

If answered incorrectly then we have the final answer in this debacle as to your political standing.

I believe in it, do you?

[Jrecee]

As for the fine for not paying for your health insurance, take a look at what happens if you dont pay the fine and get coverage, it climbs a little. Odd, if I dont have insurance then I probably dont have money for it. Therefore if I get fined I am even further behind, do you see the cycle here?

Like I said, the fine does not apply if you are under a certain income level.

[Limewater]

Let me ask though just to make sure, do you believe in the Holocaust?

If answered incorrectly then we have the final answer in this debacle as to your political standing.

I believe in it, do you?

I'm not sure what he wrote to prompt such a question, and I don't agree with everything wclem has posted, I pretty much learned the same thing about the Russian front of WWII. Not the bit about the cold, but the bit about Russia winning by just absorbing the attacks and taking huge losses, winning at great cost.

[Mod_Man_Extreme]

Let me ask though just to make sure, do you believe in the Holocaust?

If answered incorrectly then we have the final answer in this debacle as to your political standing.

I believe in it, do you?

I'm not sure what he wrote to prompt such a question, and I don't agree with everything wclem has posted, I pretty much learned the same thing about the Russian front of WWII. Not the bit about the cold, but the bit about Russia winning by just absorbing the attacks and taking huge losses, winning at great cost.

What I'm trying to ask is if he actually trusts his knowledge of history by asking the famous Holocaust denial question.

[ZeroAX]

I'm not sure what he wrote to prompt such a question, and I don't agree with everything wclem has posted, I pretty much learned the same thing about the Russian front of WWII. Not the bit about the cold, but the bit about Russia winning by just absorbing the attacks and taking huge losses, winning at great cost.

that was their first battle plan. which didn't work as well. the second was to withdraw just as blitzkrieg was about to make it's move, so the german troops never would catch up with the russian one's. now that did mean they were giving land to the germans, but russia is such a large country, they thought they had enough room to make this work. and it did. the german supply line was slow, and they had such a huge area to cover that it was impossible to defend it properly.

also if you learn your history from school history books, you really are as blind as a mole. of course school books are biased like hell. Now I won't say I know much about the cold war, or world war 1, but I've spend so many hours watching documentaries, reading online, and reading books about the second world war that I think I can form a unbiased opinion. like the fact that the german public wasn't aware of what was actually happening in concentration camps, which a lot of people on the internet blandly accuse germans off (every time someone says he is german, the number 1 argument I've seen against him is "shut up you fucking nazi").

though they did support the nazi party, they weren't informed of their monstrosities

[MrPopo]

I'm not sure what he wrote to prompt such a question, and I don't agree with everything wclem has posted, I pretty much learned the same thing about the Russian front of WWII. Not the bit about the cold, but the bit about Russia winning by just absorbing the attacks and taking huge losses, winning at great cost.

that was their first battle plan. which didn't work as well. the second was to withdraw just as blitzkrieg was about to make it's move, so the german troops never would catch up with the russian one's. now that did mean they were giving land to the germans, but russia is such a large country, they thought they had enough room to make this work. and it did. the german supply line was slow, and they had such a huge area to cover that it was impossible to defend it properly.

Exactly; they traded space for time and a logistical nightmare for the Germans. Invading armies always have the disadvantage of requiring supply lines, so targeting those supply lines is always a high priority for a defending force.

[Ack]

I'm not sure what he wrote to prompt such a question, and I don't agree with everything wclem has posted, I pretty much learned the same thing about the Russian front of WWII. Not the bit about the cold, but the bit about Russia winning by just absorbing the attacks and taking huge losses, winning at great cost.

that was their first battle plan. which didn't work as well. the second was to withdraw just as blitzkrieg was about to make it's move, so the german troops never would catch up with the russian one's. now that did mean they were giving land to the germans, but russia is such a large country, they thought they had enough room to make this work. and it did. the german supply line was slow, and they had such a huge area to cover that it was impossible to defend it properly.

Exactly; they traded space for time and a logistical nightmare for the Germans. Invading armies always have the disadvantage of requiring supply lines, so targeting those supply lines is always a high priority for a defending force.

I think it should be noted that ZeroAX is right, and the Russians had done this earlier to Napoleon.

Plus, the Germans had begun the invasion during warmer summer months, and many managed to outpace their supply lines(something the Germans had also done with their Sturmtruppen tactics in WWI). The winter being particularly brutal, and with little in way of cold weather gear, the Nazis slowed to a crawl, managing to reach Stalingrad, where the Soviets held them through the winter. And when I say nasty winter, I mean many Nazi vehicles and armor were rendered inoperable due to frozen gas tanks and other fluids.

It gave the Soviets valuable time to regroup(and train their new officers, many of which were replacing older and better experienced officers who had been removed or executed during Stalin's purges of the military in the late 1930s). The Soviets, having an extremely large population and managing to hit Nazi supply lines through use of partisan forces, then proceeded to overrun the Nazis in a human wave tactic, somewhat similar to Communist China's tactic in Korea in the early 1950s(and what Chinese military advisers supposedly attempted to pressure the Vietminh into doing to the French at Dienbienphu in 1954). The end result, the Soviets lose...what, six million people in the war? But they take Berlin and East Germany, while American, British, and Free French forces liberate France and take West Germany.

I think it's great that we started with a discussion on President Obama winning the Nobel Prize, and somewhere along the way end up in a history discussion.

[MrPopo]

I think it's great that we started with a discussion on President Obama winning the Nobel Prize, and somewhere along the way end up in a history discussion.

Well, it just goes to show that war is more interesting than peace.

[lordofduct]

My only point about Russians military prowess and what I don't get about some of the comments is this...

"russia was only doing well because it was cold"

"russia absorbed hits with large numbers"

"russia gave up land, because there was so much, it worked"


... yep... those were military tactics and defenses. Especially the cold one.

"David only kiled goliath because he had his sling."

Yep, but he still won damn it! It's not like the Yankees one because they didn't follow the rules and had players who were on steroids. No these things weren't against the rules of war... they were tactics, and they were tactics that were working. Germany did a horrible job attempting to invade Russia. I mean really, you can't "cheat" at war... when you're in a world war and some one is about to invade and kill all your people... well, no bar hold, bite em' in the nuts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I believe in a fair fight... to an extent. If it's a fair plain fight in which we are just battling for a victor (i.e. wrestling), fair, fair as can be. But if a guy attacks me! That's not a fight... that's me defending my life. And if I think there is a chance I could be seriousily hurt or maimed or even killed. Well I'm going to bite, crawl, gouge, gnaw, and everything my way through that fight. I'll shove my fingers up his ass if it means it'll get him to stop. The same goes for a war, I don't care how the hell Russia did it in the sake of the validity in its victory. They did it.


Now this doesn't mean I don't believe in the rules put forth by the geneva convention. But there are cases in which I think the rules are bullshit. If some one invaded my country (especially in clear violation of said rules)... well I ain't following them then. You're here killing my people... my citizens... you gonna answer some questions.... at the end of my gun.

And that there, that's my problem with Iraq... and the middle east in general. Screw the geneva convention, let's just remove them from the hypothetical ( I don't care if we did or didn't break the rules by invading, that's not my point). We invaded their country... plain and fucking simple. The jews invaded the palistineans. Yet we think we're so right, and when they fight back we're bewildered.

Israel is all ike "why they be shooting rockets at us." OH maybe because you shot at them!? You fucking retards.

Yeah yeah, they're different. Really freakin' different. And I don't believe, or agree, or any of the shit in what they do. And yes there are terrorists over there (in iraq though? try pakistand and afghanistan you rejects). But we still invaded them, that's not good, and anyone would get up in arms over it! Any soldier walking onto the grounds there in Iraq should not ever (and I don't think they do, I bet they know the risk) believe they shouldn't be shot at. They probably realize the fact they're on foreign soil that we invaded and there is going to be people who want to shoot us, kill us, maim us, and get us the FUCK out of there.

We don't have the right or anything to be there. Yeah we have excuses, and "ifs and buts"... but we don't have the fucking right, and really in my opinion, if they slaughtered small children in an attempt to get us the fuck out... I'm not surprised, I'm not shocked, I really could empathize with it.

Because if ANYONE walked onto my soil. Came into my country with tanks, especially under the precept of "you don't know how to run your country, so we're here to teach you how."... oh my God... I'd be biting the heads of the enemies fetuses for fuck sake.

Yey, bring democracy to the world. Some people don't want it assholes! Even here in America there are many people who call themselves socialists, anarchists, communists... and you know what, we don't believe in democracy. So why would anyone expect the rest of the fucking world to want it!? (I could make some analogies to different religions pushing their beliefs in the same way because they think they're the right ones... but then again that's one of the many conspiracy theories about the middle east anyways).