Sega Genesis SCART RGB to Component Issues (p.3 for Update)

[Mad_Hatter]

Hi, I'm trying to get Component on my Sega Genesis (don't want to S-Video mod the Genesis). Since I will be buying a RGB SCART to Component converter box on the Genesis, I thought I might try getting it on my Saturn as well since I can probably use the same converter box. First things first, the Genesis is my top priority, but I have a hungry curiosity to try out Saturn on component too.

Also, I am trying to just get the best native picture (I am not interested in any upscaling like the XRGB mini).

1) I was wondering if anyone has a converter box and SCART cable they prefer? I'm sure someone here has tried a combination and has a recommendation.

This seems like the only RGB SCART to Component box I could find.

2) I like the idea of a switch box. That way I can just use one converter box for my current and future systems. Plus, it will allow me to get stereo sound if have to buy a SCART cable with no audio RCAs.

I thought a switch box like this would be a good idea. Thoughts?


3) I really do not know much about cables, but I thought this would be good for my Genesis 2.

For the Saturn, I would prefer to buy from the same seller to save shipping. So I was thinking about this



Some minor questions and concerns:

4) With having multiple boxes (RGB to Component Box & a Switch Box), will this cause significant lag? Would I get less lag if I did not go the switch box route?

5) Regarding my Saturn, can S-Video actually look better/equal to a RGB to Component Signal? I already got Ziggy's and other member's opinion on this, but I was curious if other members had input. I'm just so damn curious to try it on a Saturn too lol.

6) Since I am converting SCART RGB to Component, would I get 50 Hz or 60 Hz?

7) Does component output a similar picture to true RGB? I don't mind if the coloring is different, but was more concerned with the clarity and resolution. Like I mentioned before, I prefer the best native picture (unmodded & no upscaling). Am I looking at the right thing in getting a RGB SCART to Component converter box?

I use a HDTV CRT. I plan on using this for Genesis 2 and Saturn Model 2. I currently use composite on my Genesis and S-Video on the Saturn.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

[TSTR]

I can answer some of this, as I've been knee-deep in SCART, RGB, converter research the last few days.

4. No lag worries with analog devices. Only when digital stuff like scaling comes into play does this become an issue.

5. S-Video can look almost as good as an RGB signal to some folks' eyes, although it technically is an inferior signal; it's really a personal preference whether you think it's worth it.

6. It's gonna output whatever refresh rate you send it.

Hope this helps some.

[Jamisonia]

its going to be a lot of money and frustration for a marginal increase in video quality. It won't be like the jump from composite to s-video.

[bmoc]

1. Can't help you with a SCART to Component box. I use a Sony PVMs instead.

2. From the picture it looks like a Hama 100S or clone. They are good low end RGB SCART switch boxes. Most people seem happy if with them if all they need is 3 inputs or less.

3. Good choice on the cables. That seller makes good stuff and is located in the US so shipping takes less time. I also recommend http://www.retrogamingcables.com if Retro Accessories is away which happens from time to time. Retrogaming Cables is UK based though.

4. It will likely depend on how your TV handles 240p component signals. Some don't handle it well. (I see now that you have a HD CRT. It should be fine.)

5. I don't have a Saturn S-video cable to test the difference but the RGB SCART cable is cheaper.

6. I'm not an expert on PAL consoles and the Hz difference but if you are using NTSC consoles on an NTSC TV then they will be 60 Hz. Are you located in North America?

7. If you are sticking with the TV that you have then I'd say RGB SCART to Component is a valid choice. It will be the best you can do without upscaling.

[Ben]

I actually do a SCART to RGB as well, using an XRGB-3 scaler and a CYP SCART to Component converter. http://junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php/XRGB-3 Game Sack has a video showing one in action: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ip6WuOvK8EU Purchased mine from here: http://www.solarisjapan.com/products/XR ... mware.html Here is where I purchased the SCART converter: http://www.cypeurope.com/store/store/ap ... onverter-- EDIT-
Sorry, I just actually looked into it, and CYP used to let you order direct from that site. Apparently you can't anymore (I bought my converter years ago), so you'll have to dig through their dealers page or hit up ebay/Amazon. Sorry about that.

As far as cables go, I bought a SCART cable from Radio Shack and just used standard Monster Cables for the component output. I play my Saturn on a 2001 27" Toshiba CRT tv that has component inputs this way and it looks fantastic. EDIT- Oh, in the case of the Saturn and Genny SCART cables (as opposed to using older Laserdisc players and whatnot with the Radio Shack cables) I have this one: http://www.retrogamingcables.com/sega-s ... -sale.html and this one: http://www.retrogamingcables.com/sega-m ... -lead.html and they work great.

Also, I can say that it does make a huge difference. I have the exact same set up Joe Redifer uses in that video, and his results are spot on accurate to mine. His video compares a Genesis via composite, s-video and SCART to component so I think it should pretty well help you decide if it was worth it. I can only say that in my experience the difference is noticable and worth it, and if you do plan to play on your HDTV in 720p that XRGB-3 scaler is worth it also.

[Anapan]

Looks like you have everything figured out already - I ran my systems through all the same hardware you listed and it was definitely worth every penny. The only reason I don't still run the same setup is because I switched to HD Plasma.

1) I have the Cypress CSY2100 and it works prefectly, tho I modded it for audio. There are other SCART RGB to Component transcoders - some are listed here:
http://gamesx.com/wiki/doku.php?id=av:av_converters
I bought most of my SCART cables from the same ebay seller you listed (Retro Console Accessories) tho I've also purchased them from http://www.retrogamingcables.com/ and http://www.consolegoods.co.uk/ - I go for the ones labled "Composite Sync" if I have the option.

2) The switch linked in the OP - Hama AV Selector 100S is the most affordable I could find that reportedly worked perfectly. I even chained 2 of them together and had no problems. No reason to choose another over that one, tho there are more good ones listed @ Videogame Perfection.

4) With the hardware you linked, there will be no lag and no loss of quality.

5) Saturn S-video is good, but on bright Reds or Greens, and on edges of hard black-white, you will probably see some dot crawl and color fringing. See this forum topic for more details. edit: Oh, it was you asking the same question

6) As mentioned above, the transcoders put out what is sent to them. My guess is 60 if you're in north america.

7) the difference on a CRT between true RGB & Component YPbPr is negligable as far as I'm able to see, but I've heard otherwise. Reguardless, unless your TV can accept RGB, it's a moot point.

If you are planning to get the SCART-Component transcoder, you should buy SCART cables for every console you own that supports it. It really doesn't get any better, and I always notice the difference between Component and S-Video (even tho it's small).

[Mad_Hatter]

Thanks everyone for the answers!!

Yea, I should have known I would get 60 Hz with my NTSC consoles lol. For some reason I thought I might get 50 since I was using a SCART.

Down to 2 more questions now:

1) As far as audio goes, if I were to get this cable, would I have to use those breakout cables to get audio? Or could I still get audio from the switch box (assuming I go the switch box route)?

2) Lastly, how would I know if I should get composite sync or raw sync? The eBay seller only sellsraw sync. Some people say it is better, some say it is not. Some say getting raw sync over composite will cause issues.

Anapan, why do you prefer composite sync over raw sync?


I couldn't really find any comparisons with the syncs other than this:

Doesn't look like syncs can affect clarity and picture, so I will just be looking for one that works and doesn't cause corrupted graphics and animations.

[Anapan]

The switch box will work for audio out no matter what.
The sync is mostly a non issue, except on some consoles on certain devices or displays. If you're using that transcoder it won't matter. I recall that some TVs and the earlier XRGB scalers had trouble on Sega and PS1 systems with raw sync.
For instance on my Genesis and playing certain PS1 240P games on my XRGB3 and Arcadeforge scaler with the old SCART cables, I'd need to run the scart through the CSY2100 first or else the picture would randomly drop out on screen/mode changes or bright scenes.
* might just be talking out my ass... been a while since this was an issue and the composite/raw issue hasn't been there after upgrading.

[Mad_Hatter]

Thanks for the answers, Anapan!

I will post pictures once I get SCART to Component converter (probably the CSY-2100)

7) the difference on a CRT between true RGB & Component YPbPr is negligable as far as I'm able to see, but I've heard otherwise. Reguardless, unless your TV can accept RGB, it's a moot point.

btw, the reason I asked about this was just to see if the component would produce the closest picture to RGB (best umodded output, which is what I always prefer). I know I won't be able to get RGB, but just wanted to make sure component wouldn't output a video way different than RGB or something.

[Mad_Hatter]

Well I got everything and the results were not good on my HDTV CRT. (Not sure what the term is for this) When there is white text in a dark background, I get a dark horizontal bar of where the text is. And I get grainy text that moves. Also, had trouble syncing the "Segggaaa" white screen during sonic 2.

I think the issue is because I am using it on an HDTV. The FPS looks lower (perhaps tv having trouble processing RGB to component). It looks like I am playing on an emulator.

I am going over a friends house later to test it on his SDTV CRT. You think I can expect different results?

If not, it looks like a sync issue then... Should I try to return this raw sync scart from ebay and buy a composite sync?

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EDIT: Just tried on on my big screen TV, same issue with the the dark horizontal bars. Though, it was not as noticeable. However, there wasnt as much lag and the fps was higher. There seemed to be some sync or connectivity issue. Because I would get a "no signal" screen during the load screens on sonic. I think the CSY 2100 has to get warmed up or something because it wouldn't happen after that even if i reset it.