Wii-U thoughts so far

[dsheinem]

You know what I mean, and are just splitting hairs at this point. Point is, you have derided others for making similar types of comments or complaints.

I really don't see what you mean.

Sure, people have complained in the past that companies are "in it for profit" and I've always said "well, of course: no conspiracy".

By trying to decide the reasons for not enabling Gamepad Wii play, I'm not necessarily saying "OMG WTF PROFIT?!?!" I am just trying to decide if that's the likely reason or if there really is some complex technical hurdle that is likely the primary factor.

[Exhuminator]

Based on everything I've been able to find on the internet, it seems the Wii U GamePad uses WiFi for both video streaming and controls. I have not been able to find an actual technical white paper dissecting the device yet though. All of my reading has been from articles such as this: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digit ... -u-gamepad

Now there still could have been a chip in the console itself that would translate the WiFi signal of the GamePad into Wii compatible inputs simulating Classic Controller or Classic Controller Pro. There's no way Nintendo did not think of that possibility while they were designing the Wii U. They left the chip out to save money on building the console, and to encourage the liquidation of existing Classic Controller and Classic Controller Pro stock.

That's my theory and I'm sticking to it. And I don't even blame Nintendo for doing it, it makes smart business sense. Less cost to build, more sales of existing devices.

[MrPopo]

One last thought experiment: If it is as easy as people for some reason think it should be, then why would Nintendo have neglected to do it when they added the update that allowed off-screen Wii play in the first place? They even went so far as to make wii mote light sensors work with the gamepad, so they obviously put some effort into it.

Right. If they wanted to go the "just rebuy your games" route they wouldn't have bothered putting in even the existing backwards compatibility they've done.

[Flake]

Based on everything I've been able to find on the internet, it seems the Wii U GamePad uses WiFi for both video streaming and controls.

Here's some 60 second Google-Fu for you:

http://wiiudaily.com/wii-u-gamepad/
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/65749762 <-surprisingly good discussion
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/0 ... _u_gamepad <-connect to PC using BT

[isiolia]

Try to help me understand the huge, costly technical barrier here. I really think it is a "we'd rather you buy these games again" kind of thing.

As I understand it, the Wii U basically maintains backward compatibility via dual booting. When you swap over to the Wii side, it closes down the Wii U OS, and boots whatever Wii ROM it includes.

Without the Wii U OS running, there isn't the ability to recognize Gamepad input and pass it on. Native support for it would need to be built into the Wii ROM, which would probably mean first integrating support for the second wifi module that the console uses to communicate with it (again, that Digital Foundry article linked earlier states that it uses wifi, not Bluetooth. The teardown doesn't even mention a BT chip in the Gamepad).

Maybe it can be done. Maybe it'd add too much to the system overhead to work, or work seamlessly at least. As I've said, I think it's an obvious thing people would want, so finding a way to make it work seems like it should have been planned, but who knows.

I think if they wanted to, Nintendo could integrate Wii (and Gamecube) support into the Wii U OS itself, rather than simply booting the Wii ROM. It'd be a lot more work though, and not as easy to just strip out down the line if they wanted to. Plus, there's probably more money in repackaging them for the VC instead.

[dsheinem]

Without the Wii U OS running, there isn't the ability to recognize Gamepad input and pass it on. Native support for it would need to be built into the Wii ROM, which would probably mean first integrating support for the second wifi module that the console uses to communicate with it (again, that Digital Foundry article linked earlier states that it uses wifi, not Bluetooth. The teardown doesn't even mention a BT chip in the Gamepad).

Ok, this is helpful. I thought the WiiU gamepad communicated via BT, since the WiiU Daily specs listed that as something built in and since the Wii U reads BT from a Wiimote (it says it "Connects via Bluetooth to the main console"). Given that it doesn't, I now see the bigger technical hurdle at play here.

[Exhuminator]

I thought the WiiU gamepad communicated via BT, Given that it doesn't, I now see the bigger technical hurdle at play here.

Exactly what I was saying earlier. The Wii U GamePad does not appear to have any sort of bluetooth transmitter within it.

Within the GamePad, the "Broadcom BCM4319XKUBG" is a WiFi chip, and the "Broadcom 20792 KMLG" is a NFC chip. Now the actual Wii U itself has a "Broadcom BCM20702" for bluetooth. That suggests that since Nintendo are using Broadcom for both WiFi and bluetooth in their console, and Broadcom for WiFi in their GamePad, that they would also use Broadcom for bluetooth in their GamePad. But since there is no Broadcom bluetooth chip in the GamePad, we can logically assume the GamePad lacks that functionality inherently.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/0 ... _u_gamepad <-connect to PC using BT

That same article you linked to says this:

UPDATE: Actually, it's the Pro Controller, not the GamePad

[dsheinem]

I thought the WiiU gamepad communicated via BT, Given that it doesn't, I now see the bigger technical hurdle at play here.

Exactly what I was saying earlier. The Wii U GamePad does not appear to have any sort of bluetooth transmitter within it.

Within the GamePad, the "Broadcom BCM4319XKUBG" is a WiFi chip, and the "Broadcom 20792 KMLG" is a NFC chip. Now the actual Wii U itself has a "Broadcom BCM20702" for bluetooth. That suggests that since Nintendo are using Broadcom for both WiFi and bluetooth in their console, and Broadcom for WiFi in their GamePad, that they would also use Broadcom for bluetooth in their GamePad. But since there is no Broadcom bluetooth chip in the GamePad, we can logically assume the GamePad lacks that functionality inherently.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/0 ... _u_gamepad <-connect to PC using BT

That same article you linked to says this:

UPDATE: Actually, it's the Pro Controller, not the GamePad

Here's the article that says the gamepad has Bluetooth and uses it to connect to the Wii U. Guess it was wrong!

http://wiiudaily.com/wii-u-gamepad/

[pepharytheworm]

Either way I still can't see this as Nintendo trying to make people rebuy games. Having a Wii pretty much built in is a bonus. My old Wii is just a gamecube now. This feature is there as an ease to transition to the WiiU if you already owned a Wii. Why even add backwards compatibility if you are wanting to make people rebuy VC titles? Again can anyone state how this is different than how they handled backwards compatibility on the Wii for GCN games? Last time I checked I couldn't use my Wii classic controller to play GCN games or even the internal memory.

[ZeroAX]

You know what's Nintendo trying to get people to rebuy VC games? The fact that you can't transfer your purchases between Wii-Wii U and 3DS (NES games)