Opinions: Nintendo's Risk-Taking.

[Exhuminator]

Well, there are also those of us that played Zero Mission instead, which is likely a bit of a different experience too (though it does include the original as an unlockable).

I adored Zero Mission, but it doesn't capture the same "feel" as the original Metroid. It's also considerably less challenging than the original Metroid. In those regards I wouldn't consider having finished Zero Mission as an analog experience to having finished the original Metroid. I'm not saying you are saying explicitly as such, just an anecdotal observation.

[Tanooki]

Finishing Zero Mission is more on par with finishing Super Metroid because of the tweaks involved to the play mechanics. The original was just one big confusing slow slog for anyone doing it blind the first time or two. It's a solid game, but you need to either map with paper, have a damn good memory, or enjoy going in circles exploring blind as that's just how it was back then.

Metroid 2 though I'd call that game nearly perfectly as good as the sequel, but the way it is laid out gets very painful that a simple map system that SM3 had would have corrected it greatly. When I do bother with the game I won't lie, I keep a map handy as it's fun but given the no color Gameboy layout it's all the more hard to remember things.

[marurun]

I find myself once again falling into the pattern of agreeing with Exhuminator.

I find the original Metroid's atmosphere more engrossing and enthralling, but Super Metroid is definitely heavy in atmosphere, just a different atmosphere. Zero Mission was a really fun game, but it aped Super Metroid's atmosphere, for the most part, and as such had a very different feel than the original Metroid. Though it may be a remake of the original Metroid, it can't really replace the experience of playing the original Metroid because of how all the changes impact the tone and atmosphere of the game.

Fusion tried to capture some of the dark and creepy of Metroid, and it actually did an admirable job, but there were a few too many cut-scene style story beats for my tastes and the game was a tad linear. But one thing I think we miss is that Metroid was graphically pretty abstract. The world felt incredibly alien due to the sparse, strange scenery. I don't think any Metroid game has attempted to replicate that kind of truly alien feel.

[Xeogred]

I think the best way to return to that darker, more open Metroid feel is to get away from the story and character. Let the visuals do the storytelling. Though we may be curious about Samus's past and the way the wider universe works, it really isn't important to the game, as the original Metroid made clear. And in this case, the less we know the better. A new game should be a new landscape, new exploration, and new puzzles. And less focus on story and a linear experience.

Yeah, we don't need Ridley Scott Alien Covenant -ting the Metroid-verse. I dislike learning more and more about the Chozo and Samus' connection, past, etc. Imagination is better.

You could write a novel about this.



I still go back to OG Metroid far more than Zero Mission and prefer it by a lot, and I could probably still give Zero Mission a 9/10 at least. Best remake in the business next to REmake (Resident Evil). Super Metroid is a lonelier feeling venture, whereas Metroid just feels outright dark and evil. It's amazing how much atmosphere that pure black background conveys on the NES. It's crazy how atmospheric it is. Zero Mission is the PG easy version.

[PartridgeSenpai]

I'm of the camp of people who prefer more modern tastes in games, I suppose. I really love Super Metroid, Zero Mission, Fusion, and even quite enjoyed my playthrough of the original Metroid II. I just can't get into the first game though. Metroid II solved a lot of problems of the first game by just being more straightforward with how each lava-lowering basically opens up a new "world" of corridor, and you could only get lost within that corridor. Metroid 1's biggest hang-up for me, lack of any map aside, is just that it's too damn hard. It's a not-fun level of hard for me. It is far more difficult than it needs to be to find health, and I just get sick of grinding for it all the time. Perhaps I'd like it more if I tried it on a NES Classic where you get the save-state option. As is on the original system, though, it's just never been my jam.

I love watching you guys' discourse on this site. Before I came here, I'd never even considered terms like "atmosphere" applied to video games, let alone such old ones. I'm always so caught up in the whole action and achievement aspect of games that I tend never to think about such stuff. I think that may be because I'm just a gamer who takes pleasure in different things, though.

[Xeogred]

Yeah I think tone and atmosphere are some of the most important elements of a game to me, even more than story most of the time.

Totally no shame doing save states or something with Metroid, the password system is a pain anyways. And if you want to consult a map no biggie on that either (I always got stuck in Norfair as a kid). It's actually pretty straightforward after a few items though. Brinstar and Norfair are actually the only main areas with a few branching paths, but both Kraid's Lair and Ridley's Lair are kind of like a big circle that wraps around and really designed to only go through them once to take out the boss and pick some stuff up along the way. Grinding can be a pain after death though, it's brutal how you only start with 30 HP haha.

It's not perfect but still one of my favorites for sure. I don't say this lightly but I still think I prefer Blaster Master over NES Metroid though. It doesn't exactly refine things though and is still extremely cryptic as well. I would argue the difficulty spikes way harder too in the last few levels. As dark and creepy as Metroid is, level 8 of Blaster Master is probably the most accurate depiction of Hell ever conceived.

Anyways if anyone wants to steer this away from Metroid feel free.

I keep wondering what the heck Retro Studios are up to. I love their stuff but it feels a little disappointing at this point in ways that their output has never been as big as Rare's was. I kind of saw them as the new Rare for Nintendo, but maybe they've always been a smaller studio in comparison or something.

[PartridgeSenpai]

I keep wondering what the heck Retro Studios are up to. I love their stuff but it feels a little disappointing at this point in ways that their output has never been as big as Rare's was. I kind of saw them as the new Rare for Nintendo, but maybe they've always been a smaller studio in comparison or something.

I'm totally okay with Retro (and to a lesser extent Good Feels) taking their time with their games. A lot of Rare's games seemed to be quite experimental and, while fun at the time, really haven't aged that well. Outside of the Banjo Kazooie games, I really can't recommend any Rare N64 game whole-heartedly. Nintendo really seems to be reinforcing their own "a bad game is bad forever (so take your damn time to make it good)" philosophy onto their 2nd parties, which I'm totally cool with. Like, sure there are some people who don't really like all of Retro's games (a lot of y'all don't like DKCR but I love 'em, and I don't really care for Metroid Prime but a lot of y'all love those), but I certainly wouldn't say they've ever made a bad game.

[BogusMeatFactory]

Since the retro question came up, let's hypothesize! Do you think they are doing an original IP, or are they revitalizing an old franchise. If so what?

I personally feel like retro is making something all new. They have paid their dues and shown time and time again that they make good games that their pitch to Nintendo was good enough to be its own thing.

[PartridgeSenpai]

Since the retro question came up, let's hypothesize! Do you think they are doing an original IP, or are they revitalizing an old franchise. If so what?

I personally feel like retro is making something all new. They have paid their dues and shown time and time again that they make good games that their pitch to Nintendo was good enough to be its own thing.

Oooooo, that's a good question. Well, let's look at other Nintendo 2nd parties. In the past, it's tough for me to find direct examples. Obvious players who one might think are directly affiliated with Nintendo often aren't. Game Freak somehow still aren't directly owned by Nintendo, and even though it took them like 7 years after DrillDozer to release a non-Pokemon game, they're still doing it every couple of years (I think Tenbo the Badass Elephant was their last one). Then you have guys like HAL Labs which, while closely affiliated with Nintendo, is still technically a separate entity. Retro is a direct division of Nintendo, so it's technically a first-party development team. They've been helping out a lot with the development of other games lately, but perhaps they're working on something of their own design. They certainly have the track record and the pedigree for it.

I will admit that I only brought them up because I thought they were developing MP4, though.

[alienjesus]

I keep wondering what the heck Retro Studios are up to. I love their stuff but it feels a little disappointing at this point in ways that their output has never been as big as Rare's was. I kind of saw them as the new Rare for Nintendo, but maybe they've always been a smaller studio in comparison or something.

I'm totally okay with Retro (and to a lesser extent Good Feels) taking their time with their games. A lot of Rare's games seemed to be quite experimental and, while fun at the time, really haven't aged that well. Outside of the Banjo Kazooie games, I really can't recommend any Rare N64 game whole-heartedly. Nintendo really seems to be reinforcing their own "a bad game is bad forever (so take your damn time to make it good)" philosophy onto their 2nd parties, which I'm totally cool with. Like, sure there are some people who don't really like all of Retro's games (a lot of y'all don't like DKCR but I love 'em, and I don't really care for Metroid Prime but a lot of y'all love those), but I certainly wouldn't say they've ever made a bad game.

Oh man, I can and would. I played through Jet Force Gemini, Perfect Dark and Blast Corps for the first time only in the last few years, and I loved them all.

The DKC games on SNES are 3 of the absolute best platformers in existence. I haven't gotten to the Retro Studios games yet, but I'm apprenhensive. They've definitely missed the atmosphere of the old games, but we'll see how the new style of gameplay holds up. It's clearly very different to the old one.

As for Retro, I'd rather they work on a new IP to be honest. I honestly think Prime was as much luck as skill in developing such a good game, and Nintendo had more influence there than people think. Prime 2 and 3 are still good, but definitely feel less special, as if Nintendo were more hands-off on that one. I think letting do their own thing on a new franchise would be best.