Do You Think Infinite Lives is Cheating?

[TSTR]

This debate makes me appreciate on-the-fly difficulty level changes. If something gets too spiky, just back it down. Of course, this seems to be a modern invention. Otherwise, I look at situations where the cheats aren't OP like invincibility or something as creating your own "easy mode" where there might not be one.

[Exhuminator]

I hate when people automatically use strategy guides AKA walkthroughs when playing a new game. Especially when playing an RPG. The excuse is usually "I don't want to miss anything". Okay, so you trade "not missing anything" for having zero surprises as you go through the game? It's a travesty. And honestly I see these kind of guides as pure unadulterated hand holding. There's enough of that built into modern games already as is.

[Luke]

It took me hours to get through the first mission of Watch Dogs. That games an instructional manual.

One of my friends named Kelly (I have a few) told me to "Game fawk it". My wife answered for me with "He won't use the internet at all to help him with games".

I'm starting to repeat myself repeat myself but I do believe my generation who grew up with the NES just coming out were hell bent on beating games without cheats. And my first non-pack in game was Top Gun, so you can imagine what determination we grew up with beating games.

To make it crystal, even using the warp whistles or warp zones was considered as cheating. Giving Lil' Mac health during rounds was considered cheating.

I don't consider this being hardcore or anything, it's just how we played. We might use a Nintendo Power Tip line "tip", but you did that and felt shame. I think most of us did use the Nintendo Power map to Metroid as we felt we paid for it (although our parents did).

I'm still trying to beat Contra 4 on the DS, and I'll tell you; the thought of cheating to unlock the original Contra has passed my mind, but I can't do it. It might take me years to beat it, but I'll be one happy mofo when I do.

[DeadPark]

I hate when people automatically use strategy guides AKA walkthroughs when playing a new game. Especially when playing an RPG. The excuse is usually "I don't want to miss anything". Okay, so you trade "not missing anything" for having zero surprises as you go through the game? It's a travesty. And honestly I see these kind of guides as pure unadulterated hand holding. There's enough of that built into modern games already as is.

I agree with the walkthroughs. i avoid them as much as possible. only really looking at them if i'm REALLY stuck, or just as a "how far into the game am i?" check.

I've also never really understood the lets play videos. if the host is funny, and you're watching for the host. that's one thing. but if you're actually watching for the full game play though, that just doesn't make sense to me.

[Snatch1414]

I agree with the walkthroughs. i avoid them as much as possible. only really looking at them if i'm REALLY stuck, or just as a "how far into the game am i?" check.

I've also never really understood the lets play videos. if the host is funny, and you're watching for the host. that's one thing. but if you're actually watching for the full game play though, that just doesn't make sense to me.

I will pull up GameFAQs in situations where it's not about beating a boss or a difficult section, but more an "Ok where the hell do I go" moment. I'm not at risk of dying I just don't know what the hell the game wants me to do next. If there's nothing preventing me from figuring it out if I sat there for another hour I just go straight to the guide, right or wrong.

[Exhuminator]

I agree with the walkthroughs. i avoid them as much as possible. only really looking at them if i'm REALLY stuck, or just as a "how far into the game am i?" check.

Yeah I don't have an issue with someone using a walkthrough to get past some byzantine thing in a game. Like when older JRPGs would forget to tell you where you're supposed to go to advance the plot for example. A quick glance to get you back on the rails isn't shameful.

What I meant was people who sit there and play through a game with the walkthrough right next to them. Literally going through the game piece by piece and walkthrough page by page simultaneously. It's a weak way to play a game, but a lot of people do it.

And I agree that glancing at a walkthrough's table of contents to give you an idea of your personal progress in a game isn't cheating at all. Sometimes it gives you the motivation to finish a game when you realize you're right at the end.

[Snatch1414]

I agree with the walkthroughs. i avoid them as much as possible. only really looking at them if i'm REALLY stuck, or just as a "how far into the game am i?" check.

Yeah I don't have an issue with someone using a walkthrough to get past some byzantine thing in a game. Like when older JRPGs would forget to tell you where you're supposed to go to advance the plot for example. A quick glance to get you back on the rails isn't shameful.

What I meant was people who sit there and play through a game with the walkthrough right next to them. Literally going through the game piece by piece and walkthrough page by page simultaneously. It's a weak way to play a game, but a lot of people do it.

And I agree that glancing at a walkthrough's table of contents to give you an idea of your personal progress in a game isn't cheating at all. Sometimes it gives you the motivation to finish a game when you realize you're right at the end.

This actually relates somewhat to my beef with achievement seekers. I really think a lot of people miss the point with these, at least in my opinion. I think you play through the game and whatever achievements you get, you get (hidden achievements are an exception).

I don't have much emotion over it I just think it's silly to go back and pick through easy to normally difficult achievements just to get them. If I play the game enough, I will get them. If not, I didn't "achieve" them.

[Exhuminator]

I just think it's silly to go back and pick through easy to normally difficult achievements just to get them.

Some people are addicted to getting gold stars I guess.

[Key-Glyph]

I look at situations where the cheats aren't OP like invincibility or something as creating your own "easy mode" where there might not be one.

^ So much this.

TSTR's philosophy is close to mine, which is, "It's cheating by definition, but if you're not in a tournament situation, who cares?" I don't think there should be a stigma to cheating. Unless you're doing it to lie about how awesome and skilled you are, just play how you want to play!

Yes, I think it's super cool when people beat difficult games legitimately, and I'm proud of the ones I'm mastered myself. But is every hard game worth investing all that time into, for every individual person? Nope. And I am 100% okay with that.

Some people enjoy content tourism of a game as much (or more than) they do its inherent challenge. Hence the tremendous success of the Let's Play format.

I'm into playing games, engaging in content tourism, and watching Let's Plays. I play the games I want to invest my money and time into; I co-pilot my husband's gaming because he like titles I'm interested in knowing about (like more modern stuff) but am not inspired to play myself; and I watch Let's Plays to view games I suspect neither one of us will get around to but that I still want to experience somehow. Of course, after watching someone play, I often decide I do want to pick up the title in question, which is cool too. I've branched out a lot this way.

I had to spend a lot of time finding a Let's Player of Five Nights at Freddy's who 1) wasn't an obnoxious asshole and 2) actually listened to the in-game instructions. When I found two people, it paid of immensely. I sought out these videos because I was curious about the game but thought they might be too stressful for me to play myself. And, when I was growing up, I always played horror games in groups. So, watching someone play recreated that feeling. And I got really invested in one of these guy, too. I found myself rooting for him and being genuinely thrilled for his success. It was really fun.

Which brings me to a question: Do you think there's a correlation between a person's tendency to game in groups (and I mean all games, not just multiplayer) and their enjoyment of Let's Plays? I'm just wondering if people who are more likely to game alone are less likely to find Let's Plays appealing.

[Exhuminator]

I`m an antisocial introvert who despises anonymous online gaming and I have zero interest in Let`s Plays, so you`re probably onto something.