Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

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irixith
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by irixith »

Forlorn Drifter wrote:I will strangle you with a gamecube controller cord if you bring Sunshine into this.
(I'm just going to preface what follows as a rant. I certainly didn't intend it to be, but hey, terrible games do bad things to good people.)

I'm up for a good strangling, but please, make it more insulting by using the worst controller of all time (an honour that belongs with the Sega Dreamcast...and there's more cord with which to do the tying, let's be fair), while I try and surmise what was worse -- Mario Sunshine or the brutal controller with which one was expected to play it with. For the sake of argument, let's ignore the obvious -- the downright idiocy of the story, the theme, the stupid water jet... (Flash Liquidizer Ultra Dousing Device? Really? REALLY? Speaking of Sega, sounds like another failed add-on...) ...it's like every element of this coat hanger abortion was ripped from the bottom of the anime storytelling barrel. All we needed was a video sequence of Mario and Shadow Mario rushing at each other in the air...but then the anime barrel isn't exactly the deepest...let's just focus on ignoring the obvious criticisms.

Sunshine may have taken a somewhat unfair amount of criticism over the years, but it's certainly buoyed by both those who can't take off their nostalgia glasses, and those who defiantly profess their love in the face of that overwhelming disdain. It's the cool thing to do now in retro gaming circles, right? Love a game that "isn't bad", that "would have been an excellent third party game", that you "just don't understand why it gets so much hate because [wilful blindness]. A game with Mario as the protagonist or main selling feature is expected to be of high quality, fun, easy to learn yet difficult to master, tight controls, etc, etc. There are certain reasonable expectations within the series given its pedigree. Much like the Legend of Zelda series, and yet two steaming turds (Twilight Princess, Skyward Sword) came in short succession, to say nothing of the missteps in the handheld series. However, that's a line item to piss off a whole 'nother set of people on a different day. Today is all about the poorest, most unpolished entry in the Mario canon.

For the record, I've played Sunshine through in its entirety. Twice. The excruciating tedium of all 240 blue coins, and the soul-crushing monotony of the 120 shines. Numbers easily remembered as the pain of the experience is forever seared into my brain. Why twice? To see if I was wrong about it the first time around...spoiler alert: nope.

So, remember that tight platforming control from...every game Mario's ever been in up until this point? Yeah, we're-a going to do away with that. To move him around, just pretend that every surface is made of ice, because he'll be sliding around more than a hotdog down a wet hallway on every surface. Oh, and when jumping, there's no call for being precise here -- make sure you land ON stuff, because god help you if you land anywhere near the edge. Oh look, he fell off again...and lost some health...and there goes the GODDAMN AUTOMATIC CAMERA RIGHT INTO THE WALL AGAIN. Good luck trying to position that shit so you can see, motherfucker, because for some arbitrary reason you can't manipulate the camera right now. Magic 8-ball says: "Results hazy. Try again later". Alright, no problem, let's just climb up that ledg---GLITCH! HAHA MARIO! Remember that when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you! You've just been Nietzsche'd, bitch!

...but wait a tic. There's that stupid FLUDD strapped to your back. Honestly this might have been more fun if Mario could have whipped out his mushroom enhanced weeny and used urine as the momentus, but FLUDD it is. Ah, there we go, a little more control over our jumps. The camera is still slapping me like I'm Tina and it's doing an Ike Turner impersonation, but I suppose I can get the hang of shitty camera, glitchy camera, while I slide around an environment that the Karate Kid forgot to wax off. Hey look I found a secret level, and Shadow Mario just stole FLUDD! Haha, sucker, take it and go live with Luigi, he's got the swallowing model of the series, know what I mean, wink, wink, say no more. I'm freeeeeee--wait, no I'm not, I just spent hours using that goddamn backpack to compensate for the most brutal control scheme to ever be featured in a Mario game. Now I get to tackle the most challenging levels in the game WITHOUT IT? Ok fine, I'm up for a challenge, Duke's lending me his b-b-b-balls of steel! 8 red coins to collect you say? On a time limit you say? No problem...wait, what the...DEATH is the penalty for not collecting the coins on time during the most difficult sections of the game without the gimmick the whole gameplay centres around and which you actually need to make jumping make any kind of logical sense?

Shit. SHIT! (Whoohoo! Backflip to my death! Backflip that I didn't ask for!) Hey, speaking of things that I didn't ask for, let's talk about the difficulty of that wall jump. Not quite the right angle? NOPE. Not quite the right speed? (What the hell is the right speed?) NOPE. It's the second Tuesday of the month and a half moon? NOPE.

So, it's time to try some more of the main game. Yoshi! Oh, my dinosaur friend! Thank fucking christ, if anything is going to save these controls from future fanboy arguments on the internet, it's you. You don't jump terribly high though, do you? Your little flutter jump is leaving quite a bit to be desired as well...and what's this, you DON'T LIKE WATER? Whatthefuckaluffagus?!?! Pianta Village + Yoshi must be in some poor disillusioned Nintendo player's suicide note somewhere. Along with a complaint about how Sunshine has half the number of levels than its predecessor, and how I think at least 56 of the shines are coin collection quests, and how there is so little variety, and how the missions are repetitive, and a single mistake sends you into the tedium of repetition, all while fighting the terrible controls, the icy surfaces and the camera that wants nothing more than to send you to the abyss at every given opportunity.

Mario Sunshine sucks.

It's got pretty decent tunes though.
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alienjesus
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by alienjesus »

irixith wrote:
Forlorn Drifter wrote:I will strangle you with a gamecube controller cord if you bring Sunshine into this.
(I'm just going to preface what follows as a rant. I certainly didn't intend it to be, but hey, terrible games do bad things to good people.).
Of all the people who poist opinions in this thread, yours are always the ones I disagree with most :lol:

I love Mario Sunshine, I adore Skyward Sword (one of the best Zelda games imo) and I think the Gamecube controller is the best controller ever made.

I'm with you on the Dreamcast controller though. That thing is atrocious. It actually makes me want to play my Dreamcast less.

I also don't tend to buy games for my XBox, not because there aren't games I want, but because I'd have to use that horrible controller. And for what it's worth, I think the XBox controller S is even worse than the giant original one - ffs, the start and select button sit right under the joint of your thumb when you use the analogue stick. Who thought that was a good idea!? The black and white buttons are equally awfully placed, and everything else about the controller is just ugly and uncomfortable.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

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The parts of Sunshine where you don't have FLUDD are pretty rad. The FLUDD parts not so much. I'd say the game has its merits, but it's 7/10 territory. It falls into that creative quagmire Nintendo was stuck in with many of its GameCube era first party releases. Star Fox Assault, Mario Kart: Double Dash, and Wind Waker have the same "good but not great" feel going on. Luckily Nintendo redeemed themselves with Metroid Prime, Smash Bros. Melee, and F-Zero GX... all stellar experiences.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by BogusMeatFactory »

Still say that Mario Sunshine would be truly amazing with a Wii Remote and Nunchuk. All of your control concerns would be gone.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

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BogusMeatFactory wrote:Still say that Mario Sunshine would be truly amazing with a Wii Remote and Nunchuk. All of your control concerns would be gone.
I guess that's what Splatoon's gonna be.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

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Exhuminator wrote:
BogusMeatFactory wrote:Still say that Mario Sunshine would be truly amazing with a Wii Remote and Nunchuk. All of your control concerns would be gone.
I guess that's what Splatoon's gonna be.
Awwwwww yeah. Excited for this game. I can't wait to play it!!! Hopefully we will see some of it in the Nintendo Direct tomorrow.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by darsparx »

Am I the only one who notices every few months sunshine is dragged in to this thread followed by someone going on a huge rant(even if they don't intend it that way) on why the game kinda stinks(which yeah it's definitely not a galaxy or 64 but still decent...). Though on the sliding I guess I'm the only one who kinda remembers it on the original mario....I remember sliding a lot in that game for some odd reason...
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irixith
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by irixith »

alienjesus wrote:
irixith wrote: (I'm just going to preface what follows as a rant. I certainly didn't intend it to be, but hey, terrible games do bad things to good people.).
Of all the people who poist opinions in this thread, yours are always the ones I disagree with most :lol:

I love Mario Sunshine, I adore Skyward Sword (one of the best Zelda games imo) and I think the Gamecube controller is the best controller ever made.

I'm with you on the Dreamcast controller though. That thing is atrocious. It actually makes me want to play my Dreamcast less.

I also don't tend to buy games for my XBox, not because there aren't games I want, but because I'd have to use that horrible controller. And for what it's worth, I think the XBox controller S is even worse than the giant original one - ffs, the start and select button sit right under the joint of your thumb when you use the analogue stick. Who thought that was a good idea!? The black and white buttons are equally awfully placed, and everything else about the controller is just ugly and uncomfortable.
:lol: :lol:

Let's make a pact to never game together. :mrgreen: I think Nintendo finally nailed 3D Mario with Galaxy 2, 3D Zelda with the HD remake of Wind Waker, and modern controllers with the Wii U Pro controller. With Sunshine specifically, I feel like if the Mario specific elements were removed, and the game had been published by say, Hudson or Majesco or even the fellows that did Ty the Tasmanian Tiger (Krome maybe?)...that it would have been accepted and rated as a mediocre platformer and the world would have moved on. It'd be a $5 bargain bin "hidden gem" as people became more forgiving after each successive console generation. It's the Mario badging that elevates its pedigree and tears it apart in equal measure. I'm going to shut up now or else I'll get ranting about it again. :lol:

As far as controllers go, I mostly agree on both counts. The controller S was a HUGE (arr arr) improvement over the original monstrosity though. The entire Xbox system as a whole reeks of experimentation and half-baked ideas...there's probably a rant around here somewhere on my feelings about the 360 controller too. (Miserable...loose analogues, smushy triggers, awkward feeling in the hand, inaccurate buttons, don't even get started on the d-pad...) That controller ruined my XBLA experience, and most retail games too. (A lot of retro games on the XBLA service demanded a precise controller/d-pad that the 360 simply didn't offer.) It wasn't until I moved to the PS3 where I was able to re-buy a lot of those games and actually complete them because the controller was just better, and the third party options were more extensive. Fast forward to the PS4/XBOne, and both have managed to create probably the best respective controllers to come from each camp, minus the lightbar on the PS4 controller. I understand why they did it, but boy does it mar an otherwise excellent piece of hardware.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

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irixith wrote:
alienjesus wrote:
irixith wrote:It wasn't until I moved to the PS3 where I was able to re-buy a lot of those games and actually complete them because the controller was just better, and the third party options were more extensive. Fast forward to the PS4/XBOne, and both have managed to create probably the best respective controllers to come from each camp, minus the lightbar on the PS4 controller. I understand why they did it, but boy does it mar an otherwise excellent piece of hardware.
Here's my unpopular opinion then: Playstation controllers suck. Every single one of them. The analogue sticks are too close together (especially on earlier systems) the buttons feel mushy (PS2 especially, probably due to the stupid analogue feature they had), the grips are too short (they were ok on PS1 before the analogue sticks were added) and an awful shape, the shoulder buttons are mounted too high to feel comfortable, the plastic always feels really light and cheap like a children's toy (ironic, considering people's thoughts on Nintendo) and the left analogue stick and d-pad are in the wrong place for 95% of the games on the systems.

That said, they're not my least favourite controllers. They're just ...really not that great. The XBox still wins, no matter what. Whether or not people think the XBox controller S or the original is better, we can generally agree that they were both shit, right?
Last edited by alienjesus on Tue Jan 13, 2015 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Do You Have Any Unpopular Gaming Opinions?

Post by BogusMeatFactory »

Yeah Playstation controllers are super uncomfortable to me, but that is because I find the WiiU Gamepad and the Original Xbox hamburger pad to be the most comfortable controllers ever, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. Curse my giant hands!
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