Win 8 no start button, screwy app area

[isiolia]

I have to say I think MS was pretty conniving on how they setup the metro panel start page, all those stupid tiles there and they all make you use some MS program and not what you want or it's useless. I like using gmail and I like using thunderbird, and that mail button won't allow it other than hotmail and msn mail I think it was, nothing thats POP based mail which sucks.

I don't think that's exactly the case. The Modern UI stuff is a different class of application. In a sense, it's like having iOS or Android apps running alongside OS X or Linux programs. The "Mail" app they put there says right up front that it does not support POP based mail. However, a different mail client might (Outlook does).

Not sure why you'd want to use Gmail over POP though, since the general way things like to connect to it is IMAP anyway (IE, if you set up a phone/tablet with the Gmail option). Last I checked, it was an extra hurdle to enable POP support in Gmail as well, where IMAP is turned on by default.

Otherwise, just install Thunderbird and pin it to Start.

It can be annoying to deal with two different app ecosystems, but it's not usually hard to ignore the Modern UI side of it. Especially if coming from Windows 7, where it wasn't an option to use anyway.

[Tanooki]

I use a pair of gmail accounts for general, and a second for more secure stuff, and then there's the ISP mail for private stuff and direct sales to big companies where it won't end up getting spam screwed. I would have liked to have used that tile to call up my emails, instead I had to erase it, leave gmail in chrome and make a tile for thunderbird.

I am ignoring the apps and possibly just going to uninstall the lot of them as they stay resident in memory and I see no reason if I don't want it.

[Niode]

I still don't understand this moaning about Windows 8. Everyone complained about the Metro shit. It was designed for their Surface products. That's all, Microsoft realised they couldn't put the Windows phone OS onto tablets as it wasn't scalable. They tried to make a weird halfway house between Windows Phone and Windows 8 called RT which went down like a lead balloon. So we get Windows 8.1. Honestly, if you don't like the Metro stuff. Don't use it. Win+X will get you all the options you would've used your start menu for and then some. IF you need to access an application just press the windows key and start typing, within three keypresses it has usually found what you are looking for. It's training you to use your operating system in a more efficient way instead of using the mouse all the time. The improvements to the regular desktop UI and the improved boot times are worth using Windows 8.1 alone. I honestly don't know what the big fuss is about. Why you would want to go back to XP or Win7 interface is beyond me as that would be a major step backwards.

TL;DR Don't like Metro, Don't use it, it's as simple as that.

[Hobie-wan]

TL;DR Don't like Metro, Don't use it, it's as simple as that.

Just because people keep saying that doesn't excuse the fact that it was a disastrous step backwards for desktop usability that nobody asked for and most don't like.

I like keyboard shortcuts, but I also like clicking on some things that aren't hidden and don't move places all the damn time too. When I'm walking a customer through something on the phone I don't get a choice what they're using. If I'm remoted into a customer I don't get a choice what OS they're using either.

[Tanooki]

No argument about the faster boot times, even with a lot more junk on this laptop loading up at start in the memory, it's fast. The system gets itself up quick to that pre-load screen and then into where I put my password and pop right to the desktop. As nicer as 7 was over shitty Vista, this is even quicker.

As hobie said though, them trying to force a tablet world on a non-tablet computer or laptop was a bullshit stunt and it backfired badly. 8.1 is nice, but the lack of the ability to opt into a win7 like start menu stinks. I never heard of Win+X, I settled on Classic Shell which is awesome as you can use any form of windows from 9X forward as far as how the start menu and even explorer handles. I just went with Win7 as I like it a lot, and I have cleaned all the MS only usable trash off the metro panel and as it is, there's a few things there. The best way I can explain it to myself is that Metro is an Android OS wannabe. The main panel is the icons you want there or the few the OS shoves there you can remove, and then the sub-panel below is like the 'settings' icon in Android where you get pages and pages of sliding screens with every icon clustered A-Z or however you like. It's not bad, mostly, though it's pretty ignorant having it pull up every single doc, html, uninstall link and other crap from their hidden start menu that you need to un-pin(remove) to clean up -- lots of wasted time/effort.

I'm all for keyboard shortcuts too since the original Windows 3.x era forward, but sometimes if it's within 1-3 clicks I'd rather do that as it's about as fast if not faster since it's not digging.

Also I'm not sure if you're aware or not, but the Win7 start menu is NOT a step backwards. Have you seen what Windows 10 will be using? It's the Win7 style menu, but to the right where 7 has (docs, pics, music) that vertical cluster of text they'll be stuffing metro panels into that little spot. They're mixing the main metro full screen page with the win7 start menu. That's where it's going next year when that drops. I don't hate Metro but it was very poorly setup where you need to do a lot of work to make it right, but if you do it's fine.

[ExedExes]

Dang, my post got eaten, this isn't the first time.

Having upgraded to computers with 8.1, there is one nice feature of the faux Start button -- all the stuff you get when you right click. Device Manager, Power Options, Control Panel, Search, Run, all right there. Plus, Win Key + S is a heck of a better Search tool than the ones in previous versions.

I just threw folders with my games, utilities, and other stuff on the desktop. Add Firefox and I don't even need a start button anymore.

I love the fast boot times and no BSODs either.

[Niode]

As hobie said though, them trying to force a tablet world on a non-tablet computer or laptop was a bullshit stunt and it backfired badly. 8.1 is nice, but the lack of the ability to opt into a win7 like start menu stinks. I never heard of Win+X, I settled on Classic Shell which is awesome as you can use any form of windows from 9X forward as far as how the start menu and even explorer handles. I just went with Win7 as I like it a lot, and I have cleaned all the MS only usable trash off the metro panel and as it is, there's a few things there. The best way I can explain it to myself is that Metro is an Android OS wannabe. The main panel is the icons you want there or the few the OS shoves there you can remove, and then the sub-panel below is like the 'settings' icon in Android where you get pages and pages of sliding screens with every icon clustered A-Z or however you like. It's not bad, mostly, though it's pretty ignorant having it pull up every single doc, html, uninstall link and other crap from their hidden start menu that you need to un-pin(remove) to clean up -- lots of wasted time/effort.

Then don't fucking use it. It's as simple as that man. Seriously. Disable it at boot and don't use it. I've never once used the metro on my desktop PC. The only time it has ever been useful was with Xbox Music (before they made it shit, i.e. when it was basically Spotify without the bullshit) when I've hosted house parties and I let people queue music up on it. The interface was great for my living room TV. There is nothing forcing you to use Metro, at all.

I'm all for keyboard shortcuts too since the original Windows 3.x era forward, but sometimes if it's within 1-3 clicks I'd rather do that as it's about as fast if not faster since it's not digging.

HAHAHA yeah... right... Good joke.

Also I'm not sure if you're aware or not, but the Win7 start menu is NOT a step backwards. Have you seen what Windows 10 will be using? It's the Win7 style menu, but to the right where 7 has (docs, pics, music) that vertical cluster of text they'll be stuffing metro panels into that little spot. They're mixing the main metro full screen page with the win7 start menu. That's where it's going next year when that drops. I don't hate Metro but it was very poorly setup where you need to do a lot of work to make it right, but if you do it's fine.

I've got Win 10 Preview Enterprise (I have an MSDN account) and yes I've seen the menu. I seriously don't understand peoples hangups with the start menu. You seriously want to use your computer by moving your mouse to a button, then fumble around with a clunky menu to find what you want? What's wrong with you? Just press Windows key and type. 1,000,000,000x faster.

If you want to continue using your computer like a fucking troglodyte be my guest...

[sonic2041]

I tried in the Apps panel to go through explorer and cluster things I wanted together into a 'Good old Games' folder, and so on, and anything I dragged in there would then stop working on the apps panel until put back.

When adding links to C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs, which is what I assume you were doing, you have to add a shortcut, otherwise the file you open will be looking for files that don't exist in that directory.

[Tanooki]

Niode I have no idea what crawled up your ass and died but your attitude sucks.

I don't intend to use Metro unless I get bored at some point and decide to mess with it. It's not like I'm being forced to as I put Classic Shell on this.

I must have missed the joke as I wasn't kidding, I like using my mouse and I like keyboard shortcuts. I don't strictly just like to type the name of whatever I want to use and press enter and haven't since DOS went out of style. I'll do it sometimes as it's far faster than going menus deep for something, but if I have it right up in front I couldn't care less.

I'm curious where you get off being that rude and arrogant saying by using the start menu button and a mouse makes someone a troglodyte. You're the troglodyte wanting to jump back to the black and white day of the computer typing in commands and names of stuff to get the programs you want up and running. Perhaps it's you who needs to modernize and set things up so you can tap a button or two and have things work.

[MrPopo]

I'm curious where you get off being that rude and arrogant saying by using the start menu button and a mouse makes someone a troglodyte.

He's a British soccer hooligan who sometimes posts on the site.

You're the troglodyte wanting to jump back to the black and white day of the computer typing in commands and names of stuff to get the programs you want up and running. Perhaps it's you who needs to modernize and set things up so you can tap a button or two and have things work.

The search in Win 8 is quite nice; if I want to pull up Notepad I can just go Win+S, type n-o-enter, Notepad pops up (unless I had a program that also starts with No that I use more frequently than Notepad, in which case I type a few more letters). It's certainly far faster than the mouse.