Gypsy Split

[KalessinDB]

Romanian gypsies strike again! They've burgled two homes in my street during the night. The police has warned the neighbourhood of further crime from what they suspect as Romanian gypsies.

Deport them all, they are a liability.

Vague accusations of racism aside, I absolutely adore you for using the phrase burgled.

[ZeroAX]

oh dear...

[dsheinem]

What is racist about complaining about a group of people who pickpocket and steal for a living? I don't want these people living near me, all it adds is stress and worry due to their constant lust for law-breaking.

The Indians, Pakistanis and Bangladeshis came here to create job opportunities, boost the economy and so on. The Africans came here and integrated very well amongst our society and became lawyers and teachers, while bringing their colourful and happy cultures. The Chinese came here and opened up restaurants and are astute businessmen and women. The Turks opened businesses and takeaways. The Poles work hard. The Roma gypsies came here to be a general nuisance.

It is almost impossible to accommodate them. We gave them homes, only for them to illegally rent out the rooms. We gave them food vouchers, yet they still steal from supermarkets. We gave them shelter, yet they are still out in the streets in the pouring rain pickpocketing. We gave them access to the job market, yet they would rather claim benefits for a living. We allow their children to go to school, yet they refuse to speak English. We welcomed them with open arms, yet they still stabbed us in the back.

This isn't just my point of view. Literally no-one wants them as neighbours. This isn't about race or religion. This is about a culture that is way too thorny and destructive. How come all other cultures adapt well into our multi-cultural society without much problems? This morning while queuing up for the annual flu vaccinations, everyone queues up peacefully from all backgrounds, then the gypsies turn up late, skipping the queue with their pushing and shoving while aggravating a lot of people.

Dude, do you forget we've been over this?

http://racketboy.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 07#p828707

http://racketboy.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 14#p828714

To quote myself:

The problem is that you too often keep grouping all gypsies and pretty much all Roma people into one category of "filthy pickpocketing pimps of their own children" or similar. The "gypsy" culture is rich with its own (positive and unique) history and traditions that should absolutely be celebrated and welcomed (e.g. "gypsy" art, music, and dance) into any culture. All your posts smack of xenophobic paranoia and misplaced, sweeping prejudice. I don't have first hand experience with this particular group/groups of immigrants, but the hateful rhetoric is more or less beat for beat the same as what we encounter from bigots in the U.S.

Stricter background checks? Sure: excellent idea. But perhaps if the culture were more welcoming and accommodating of existing immigrants who have passed the checks that are already in place, you'd find that immigrant-related crime and most associated anti-British/Western sentiment would drop off precipitously. If I went somewhere and encountered people who hate me because of my country of origin or cultural identity, I'd be pretty inclined to say "fuck these people" too.

To quote you:

I can see what I've done with my wording... sigh.

[mjmjr25]

All your posts smack of xenophobic paranoia and misplaced, sweeping prejudice. I don't have first hand experience with this particular group/groups of immigrants, but the hateful rhetoric is more or less beat for beat the same as what we encounter from bigots in the U.S.

Dave, is it possible you are making sweeping arguments in this case? You would agree, I think, that Europe, particularly Western Europe is far more inclusive and accommodating than the US, yes? Then you must ask yourself why quite literally every country in Europe has a problem with integrating their Roma populations and each article i've read, each news story i've seen, echoes Adam's view - they, as a WHOLE, DO NOT WANT to assimilate. We aren't just talking Hungary and Bulgaria - this is France, Italy, the UK, the Czech's.

You say you've never experience them firsthand (most of us in the US have not) so i'd suggest a little leeway in education from our Euro friends whom have.

It seems you'd like us to be sure to not assign attitudes or titles to an entire culture and I would almost always agree with you - however, in this case, it seems appropriate and doesn't need to be overthought. There are so very few cases of a Roma breaking free of the bonds and behaviors of this culture. I did find one, Marian, an 80 yo Roma from NE Romania. So, apply Adam's comments to All Roma except Marian.

[MrPopo]

You know, maybe he plans to lobby for them to put back up Hadrian's Wall to keep them out. Then it'd be a perfect one-to-one with US anti-Mexican bigotry.

[mjmjr25]

You know, maybe he plans to lobby for them to put back up Hadrian's Wall to keep them out. Then it'd be a perfect one-to-one with US anti-Mexican bigotry.

...speaking of sweeping generalizations. The peanut gallery arrives...

[darsparx]

You know, maybe he plans to lobby for them to put back up Hadrian's Wall to keep them out. Then it'd be a perfect one-to-one with US anti-Mexican bigotry.

Doesn't help when the Mexican thing really got going after the '08 fallout with the economy(i mean jobs were hard to come by anyways and the fact there may be people coming willing to work for less so they get the job so the employer doesn't seem racist didn't help matters, though I think it's just the fact employers are cheap and another race just became a scapegoat in the process...)

[Luke]

You say you've never experience them firsthand (most of us in the US have not) so i'd suggest a little leeway in education from our Euro friends whom have.

Sure, Dave may have not had experience with "Roma's" but I have. And since I have had such first hand experience, I can say you're being shortsighted. And to lump an entire group based on few experiences is moronic. Dumb. Dumb dumb dumb.

I grew up in an area of Chicago where English was a third language. More Polish people lived in Chicago than in Poland. No joke. Plenty or Irish, plenty of Italians, tons of Roma's. I can assure you each "sect" if you would like, has their issues. But to classify and categorize an entire population with "hey.. hows bout listening to the euro dudes" is so folly it is...dumb. dumb dumb dumb.

"Education from a bigot". Jesus fucking christ.

[alienjesus]

You say you've never experience them firsthand (most of us in the US have not) so i'd suggest a little leeway in education from our Euro friends whom have.

Hi, I'm a European and I'd like to believe I qualify as a Euro friend. I have seen problematic Roma gypsies. I also know that it is not all Roma gypsies who are problematic. I found Adam's statement narrow minded and fairly racist.

[ZeroAX]

Dave, is it possible you are making sweeping arguments in this case? You would agree, I think, that Europe, particularly Western Europe is far more inclusive and accommodating than the US, yes? Then you must ask yourself why quite literally every country in Europe has a problem with integrating their Roma populations and each article i've read, each news story i've seen, echoes Adam's view - they, as a WHOLE, DO NOT WANT to assimilate. We aren't just talking Hungary and Bulgaria - this is France, Italy, the UK, the Czech's.

You say you've never experience them firsthand (most of us in the US have not) so i'd suggest a little leeway in education from our Euro friends whom have.

It seems you'd like us to be sure to not assign attitudes or titles to an entire culture and I would almost always agree with you - however, in this case, it seems appropriate and doesn't need to be overthought. There are so very few cases of a Roma breaking free of the bonds and behaviors of this culture. I did find one, Marian, an 80 yo Roma from NE Romania. So, apply Adam's comments to All Roma except Marian.

It's a complex matter. I think both parties (European societies and their roma populations) are to blame, but as the ones in a stronger position we should try more.

Also I did some volunteer work in a school with roma kids in the Czech republic, and I DID NOT appreciate how the teacher was telling the kids that they are too stupid to ever achieve anything in their lives.

And about breaking free of the culture: you try integrating into a society that considers you inferior because of your origins. You are basically asked to be spat on the face and bow down your head to it.

Of course the other side has valid arguments too, all good willed efforts to integrate them have failed, but unless we want to go all hitler again, we have to keep trying.

And at least in my country, I am ashamed to say, a huge part of the problem is that they don't vote usually so no government spends enough money to try and help them out of their predicament (why spend money on roma when we can spend more money on nepotism).