World is Falling Apart Thread (Locked forever)

[Ack]

A few things:

First, there have been reported cases of fraud in the Scottish independence referendum, by impersonation. It's not many, but it was reported, and police are investigating.

Second, Adam is fiercely in the YES camp because of his issues dealing with a government that he feels has treated him and his wife poorly but also disrespects its neighbor citizens in favor of concentrated power in the political and financial capitol and generally disregards the needs of his people. He is unhappy about its policies and feels they have become so poorly handled over the years that it is worth it to break away and allow more autonomy. It should be noted that a large part of this is related to his experiences with immigration law, which has been taken away entirely from his homeland in favor of London political ideologues and parliamentarians.

General_Norris believes nationalism and patriotism are both horrid concepts that have ultimately caused more harm than good, resulting in war, economic mistreatment of other nations, and prejudice. It should also be noted that the nation he is from, Spain, is dealing with the issue of Catalonian independence and has just started to emerge from a difficult period of recession, which is what led to this independence movement.

I figure that brief explanation of your backgrounds may at least help the two of you to come to a better understanding for each other's views. In America, CNN has already moved on to something they find more important than anything: airplane crashes.

[Sload Soap]

From what I can gather there was a grand total of ten spoiled votes. Pretty par for the course and certainly not the signs of some Mi5 lead conspiracy as I've seen some rather dubious sources claim. It smacks of paranoia from the Yes campaign to be honest.

Salmond has gone now which was sort of inevitable. And there is talk now of devolution of powers for all the nations of the UK which is at least a step forward.

In the end this became a win/win situation for Scotland and the three major parties have now made some rather rash pledges they will no doubt try to slowly reverse out of in the run up to the election. There is already a rift among Labour party members about Cameron's pledge and that shit-shower UKIP leader Lord Voldemort Nigel Farage has started beating the drum about the "West Lothian question" (that being why do Welsh, Scottish and Irish ministers get votes on things that purely effect England).

Just as an aside, I found it interesting that the majority of Yes votes came not from the areas you'd expect like the Highlands, Shetland and Orkney but from densely populated cities like Dundee and Glasgow. I believe this is a good indicator that, as I suspected, a lot of anti-Union sympathy was less out of a desire to be truly independent but more a need for local issues to be given more consideration (and funding) which hopefully will happen now with increased devolution.

I know this sounds obvious but I need to stress that this isn't an issue exclusive to Scotland which is why many English and Welsh people have been a bit bristley about this referendum: many cities in the UK feel that similar powers should find their way to local councils. Manchester and Liverpool don't plan to secede to get those powers however.

[ZeroAX]

http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlema ... referendum

Perhaps most galling for separatist Catalans, though, is that the resolution that appears to be taking shape in Scotland is not an option for them. In the wake of its “no” vote, Scotland will enter into negotiations over increased self-government and budgeting powers that London promised it as a reward for voting to stay in the Union. Catalonia cannot negotiate to win more such powers from Madrid, for the simple reason that it already has them.

This is the main reason I feel different about this "referendum". It stinks of lack of solidarity. It's like Bavaria saying they don't want to subsidy eastern German states, or NY not wanting to pay for....I don't know, what's a really poor USA state?

[Ack]

So...anyone heard about China's ambassador to Iceland?

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/09/1 ... RN20140917

[Forlorn Drifter]

http://www.economist.com/blogs/charlema ... referendum

Perhaps most galling for separatist Catalans, though, is that the resolution that appears to be taking shape in Scotland is not an option for them. In the wake of its “no” vote, Scotland will enter into negotiations over increased self-government and budgeting powers that London promised it as a reward for voting to stay in the Union. Catalonia cannot negotiate to win more such powers from Madrid, for the simple reason that it already has them.

This is the main reason I feel different about this "referendum". It stinks of lack of solidarity. It's like Bavaria saying they don't want to subsidy eastern German states, or NY not wanting to pay for....I don't know, what's a really poor USA state?

Essentially, they just don't want to use their money to cover other areas of the country? So, more of a confederacy leaning idealism?

Or am I misunderstanding?

[ZeroAX]

Essentially, they just don't want to use their money to cover other areas of the country? So, more of a confederacy leaning idealism?

Or am I misunderstanding?

I wouldn't know, I don't know what confederacy idealism is other than slavery

[ZeroAX]

Holly shit it's true

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 45333.html

I can't believe it's the WINNERS of the referendum causing trouble.

[Sload Soap]

Shit sounds serious!

No, wait: ten arrests, crowd dispersed at about 9 o'clock, no injuries, definitely no deaths, usual hyperbole from Adam.

Sounds more like a typical friday night in Glasgow to me.

[Forlorn Drifter]

Essentially, they just don't want to use their money to cover other areas of the country? So, more of a confederacy leaning idealism?

Or am I misunderstanding?

I wouldn't know, I don't know what confederacy idealism is other than slavery

Please, tell me more.

The idea of a confederacy, in simple forms, is a weak federal government and strong state governments. The federal government only comes in on things that a state couldn't do alone, such as war and foreign policy and such. If the UK was a confederacy, for an example, Scotlands taxes wouldn't go outside the area- it would be Scottish money for Scottish people, and all there laws are their own. They wouldn't pay for wellfare in England, could have laws conflicting with those in Wales, and it wouldn't matter. Essentially, its like a bunch of small countries, who are considered one for dealing with other countries.

[oxymoron]