Wii-U thoughts so far

[dsheinem]

wait, so you can't play Wii games on the Wii U gamepad using the gamepad's d-pad/buttons?!?!

Fucking stupid.

[Flake]

wait, so you can't play Wii games on the Wii U gamepad using the gamepad's d-pad/buttons?!?!

Fucking stupid.

I knew the post-E3 honeymoon wouldn't last too long.

Wii mode on the WiiU isn't done through hardware ala emotion chip installation in early PS3's for PS2 software compatibility. On the WiiU it's done through software emulation. I doubt it's a technical impossibility to tweak that emulator to accept WiiU Pad input but I also doubt it could be done without hurdles.

The biggest challenge would be modifying the Wii emulator's code to accept input from the gamepads buttons while still streaming the video data over the same wifi connection. The gamepad doesn't use bluetooth the same way the wiimote does. Emulation is not as simple as saying "hey this machine is x times more powerful than that so it can run that machines software and only use y amount of its resources".

This isn't even taking into account the sheer number of games that wouldn't work as intended. How many Wii retail games would work correctly with the WiiU pad as the sole controller? For every Tatsunoko vs Capcom, you have a Metroid Prime 3 or a Mario Galaxy. How would games even be able to recognize the WiiU pad? You'd have to put some type of code in there that tricked the Wii emulator into thinking it saw both a Wiimote and a connected classic controller - or for some games, just a Wii mote held sideways. More coding for something that really isn't being demanded.

So no, it's not fucking stupid. It's the exact same "effort vs return" calculation Sony made when they decided the PS4 would not be compatible with most PS3 controller accessories. The same calculation Microsoft made when they decided to only go so far with oXbox emulation on the Xbox 360 (also requiring new controllers). No one is saying "I'd buy me a WiiU if only I could play Wii mode games using the Wii pad and only the Wii pad".

You can read up on the WiiU pad here, where the clever guys behind the Dolphin emulator tore down a WiiU pad and talk a little about the technology behind it. It's a pretty good read and has some surprising insights.

[dsheinem]

wait, so you can't play Wii games on the Wii U gamepad using the gamepad's d-pad/buttons?!?!

Fucking stupid.

I knew the post-E3 honeymoon wouldn't last too long.

I'm not married to any console or company, so there's never any "honeymoon." I have been less than impressed with things I've discovered about Wii U hardware since I got it. I'm also let down by the lack of new stuff to play on the Xbox One, which I've had disconnected for weeks now.

You'd have to put some type of code in there that tricked the Wii emulator into thinking it saw both a Wiimote and a connected classic controller - or for some games, just a Wii mote held sideways. More coding for something that really isn't being demanded.

So no, it's not fucking stupid.

Obviously the Wii Classic Controller works fine to navigate Wii menus, etc. I turn on and play plenty of Wii games without ever pointing a Wiimote at a sensor bar. I think that this should be the default way that the Wii U gamepad works too. It might take some "more coding or something" but I think it should have been done from the start. I hope it gets realized in a future firmware release, but I suspect its absence is largely to push people to rebuy stuff on the Wii U VC.

[BoneSnapDeez]

Yeah I would love to play Classic Controller Wii games on the Wii U gamepad, with the image showing up on the screen. Something like Muramasa would be amazing on it.

[AppleQueso]

Yeah I think wii u gamepad > classic controller is probably feasible, and I suspect Dave's right in that it's absence is probably a way to push people into re-buying VC games on the Wii U.

Anything beyond that is unrealistic, I don't think Dave is expecting Nintendo to spend time and resources to find workarounds to make Wii games that were never compatible with CC compatible with the Wii U pad.

[ZeroAX]

I don't think Nintendo did it on purpose I think they just SUCK at the technical side of designing consoles (search on google for an interview with a Wii U developer who talks about the nightmare of having to debug stuff on the Wii U prior to launch, or nintendo's online infrastructure (or lack thereof) a few months before release.

[dsheinem]

I think they just SUCK at the technical side of designing consoles

I don't know about this - I mean they have the Wii U gamepad thing working pretty well for all of its primary features, they clearly hit it out of the park with motion controls and backwards compatibility on the Wii, and their systems have historically had some of the lowest failure rates compared to the competition. They also marry game design to hardware in a way few companies do. I think that their consoles could be much more full featured, but on the other hand the features that are there are at least well made.

Uh oh, that almost reads like a post praising/defending Nintendo!

[AppleQueso]

Nintendo's hardware stuff is an absolute enigma. For everything done well, there's a ton of stuff that just makes zero sense.

I mean this is a company that is just now barely figuring out how to do online properly.

[cha cha]

I don't know where the logic for "the Wii U game pad shouldn't work with emulated Wii games because how would the touchscreen be recognized?" Like the controller portion and screen portion are somehow tied together, which they aren't... I could easily see the screen just displaying a simple graphic for the game you are playing and displaying 'Wii mode' while playing. Saying that shouldn't be possible and is hard to do, is like saying Nintendo DS shouldn't play GBA games because GBA wouldn't utilize one of the screens...

I suspect Dsh is correct and Nintendo is using this as a way to push people into re-buying new VC content.

[sevin0seven]

Uh oh, that almost reads like a post praising/defending Nintendo!

dsheinem; the defender of NINTENDO! (Voltron voice)..