PS2 Appreciation Thread

[Sano]

I am going to call it Semi-Retro. In another 5 years I will go for calling it retro.

[darsparx]

I find it hard to not call it retro the more I think about it. Most of the systems we call retro have graphics that look really pixelated(kinda referring to n64 to some extent or ps1 take your pic), and textures look flatish. Not to mention at least in kingdom hearts the acting with the 3d models wasn't that great compared to what we have now for 3d acting when it comes to cutscenes. I mean it too, looking at sora or a few others you don't see many facial expressions.

[G4Vi]

Not going to compare with dictionary definition, just what retro means to me in the context of video game consoles.
While n64 and psx are retro to me,
I don't think the ps2 is retro yet:

Lack of main differences from ps2s to the modern consoles - the modern consoles have bigger storage sizes, better graphics, but they also have a lot of similarities, they both have hard drives, disc drives with games on dvd, online multiplayer games, online marketplace for games(japan did at least). While HD wasn't popular when the ps2 came out, a significant amount of games came out with types of hd/edtv support in areas of widescreen, progressive scan, and higher resolutions, some games even supported 720p and 1080i. The last gen(360 ps3) wasn't really much improvement in terms of resolution as most games didn't even run at true 720p(to be fair they did scale better, the 360 pulled down the ps3's average). {Something to note was people's tvs changed over the generation as ps2 games were mostly played with crts and the later generation with flat screens, Many people's ps2 experience were limited to composite video with resolutions of about 320 by 240 screens(fuck non square pixels), thus the newer consoles on hd screens were a bigger improvement.}

Officially released titles came out not long ago/Foreign markets:
Mostly just sport games, but Fifa14 came out in September 2013. PES14 came out in November 2013 for ps2. In 2005 the last psx game was released(2004 for some countries), I wouldn't have called it retro then. The n64 might have been retro at that point though as the last game was THPS3 and came out in 2002, and was cartridge based. (Cartridges don't make the NDS retro because they were pretty much flash memory as opposed to n64 carts and older that had more complex circuits and abilities such as adding ram.) Due to cost, many people in foreign markets haven't transitioned to newer consoles or recently transitioned making this not retro.

The ps2 is old isn't retro now, but is getting closer, needs a little time. The order of things going retro I think is Gamecube(might already be retro), xbox(might already be retro), ps2, wii, 360, ps3.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pl ... HD_support
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_la ... e_consoles

This would be for other threads, but I think more interesting debates would be whether the gamecube or the xbox are retro. Gamecube doesn't have hd but had limited internet and wii similarities. Xbox has similarities with future consoles, but live was disabled and hasn't seen a game in a while.

[RCBH928]

When I joined this website, the PlayStation had been released 13 years before, had been discontinued just two years before I signed up for this forum, and we called it retro. Now, the PlayStation 2 was released 14 years ago, has been discontinued almost two years, and we're still debating.

Food for thought.

Exactly, this is why retro-ism is tied to relativity not age. If its current, then its not retro. If it is using an old trend that was once popular, it is considered retro. I bet when PS2 was released in 2000, the SNES looked like something from the stone age even though only 5 years ago it was still the top selling console and that is younger than a ps3 today. No one is calling ps3 old tech. To be honest, I have a very hard time distinguishing PS4 screenshots and PS3 screenshots but thats another discussion...

Ehhh....I don't really feel like this is true. Xbox to 360 was a lot closer in terms of look IMO.

You know you brought me attention to something. All Xbox games look just as good from launch to the very end. I didn't notice that it had weak graphic at launch and by the end of the generation they were superb. Can you provide examples?

@G4Vi

480p is considered HD?


Out of topic but... any one notices a difference between 1080p and 1080i? I know the technology is different but I really doubt it that one would say "I only play in progressive mode"

I am not even sure why they have it sometime in the option of some media devices, I would pick 1080p whenever I can though.

[G4Vi]

@G4Vi

480p is considered HD?


Out of topic but... any one notices a difference between 1080p and 1080i? I know the technology is different but I really doubt it that one would say "I only play in progressive mode"

I am not even sure why they have it sometime in the option of some media devices, I would pick 1080p whenever I can though.

I don't think 480p is currently considered hd, though at first was before 720p and 1080p became popular. Generally it's classified under EDTV or Enhanced Definition Television. Nonetheless it is a huge improvement over 480i or lower resolutions, try Burnout 3 at highspeeds on a hdtv, and then hold cross and triangle at boot and enable progressive scan. You'll notice a huge difference and be able to see ahead easier resulting in much less crashes.

I think people notice the difference between 1080p and 1080i. The only thing I play at 1080i is ps2 games and television I think as TV is usually 1080i I think. The I stands for interlaced and essentially means there is have as much vertical information, so frames have to be interpolated. The Bluray of breaking bad probably looks a lot better than what came in on cable. LCD screens have to handle interlacing with their processors, so it can look bad in some cases, interlaced works better with crt screens as the "gun" simply doesn't move quite as much and so the frames are blended more naturally.

[BoneSnapDeez]

I'm really only comfortable labeling the Dreamcast and everything that came before it as "retro." Personal preference I guess.

[ninjainspandex]

do you think we are reluctant to call the PS2 retro because that would require us to admit that we are getting old?

[RCBH928]

@G4vi

how do you play PS2 games in 1080i? Using an emulator with enhanced textures?

do you think we are reluctant to call the PS2 retro because that would require us to admit that we are getting old?

I think this is true too. I noticed this talking to younger people when I call some artist or actor as "new" while they feel he is old. Its also true in songs. I heard younger people call a song "OLD" when it was released in 2006-05. For example, Chamillionaire Ridin Dirty is probably considered classic by now. "Can't Touch This" is old, Riding Dirty is pretty recent... at least to me.

Its like when you are 16 and something you saw or heard when you were 8 was ions ago, but when you are 32 and you saw something or heard it when you were 24, its not that old (ex..Youtube, Facebook). Megan Fox was starring 7 years ago in Transformers, but to me she is as new as actors can get.

[Zing]

I'd use the word to describe any system that most people wouldn't even consider playing at this point. I know that is dangerously close to "obsolete", but I don't like that word to describe video games. The games themselves can never become obsolete, and the consoles are just an extension of the game.

The PS2 is a system that most people don't even consider when they think of video games. Just as we didn't consider the Atari 2600 during the SNES era. Most people have essentially forgotten the PS2 exists.

So, I don't know if the PS2 perfectly fits the term "retro", but it is clearly from a forgotten era of gaming. The technology and game design is significantly different from the following generation, and much more closely resembles prior consoles and game design than anything afterward.

[G4Vi]

@G4vi

how do you play PS2 games in 1080i? Using an emulator with enhanced textures?

PS2 emulation isn't quite there yet, at least for most games and machines, but I think its the future. While PCSX2 can play most ps2 games, having completely stable fps is a problem. On my laptop (i7 4700mq 2.4ghz, 8gb ram, nvidia 750m gt 2gb vram), it runs Burnout 3 at full speed for the most part, but stutters every once and a while annoying the hell out of me. It isn't really any more difficult for my computer to run at double native resolution, but it still has the same stutters ofcourse. In a few years however it might then be better to play ps2 games on a computer given the ability to tweak resolutions, have texture filtering, MSAA among other tweaks to get the most of games.

On the list it shows the games that natively support 1080i, but at you can see there aren't that many. Usually either there's a setting in the menu or you hold a button combo to enable.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pl ... HD_support

My PS2(technically my memory card) is modded with free mcboot. I use GSM or Graphics Mode Selector to change the output video settings. It doesn't work with all games and requires a little of trial and error, but can make a lot of games looks better by forcing resolutions such as 1080i, also allows me to run foreign games on my US console. The new builds of Open PS2 Loader integrate GSM with it, so the settings can be forced for playing games from windows share(SMB), internal hd, or usb. Note usb sucks bad because its only usb 1.1.