Always hated FPS games, but Bioshock Infinite.....

[Retrogamer0001]

A good or bad save system should have absolutely nothing to do with the difficulty of a game - that's basically like saying if a game has bad graphics or bad music, it only adds to the difficulty. It's a technical flaw, and was a major downgrade compared to the two older games in the series, and considering the state of gaming today, there really isn't any excuse to incorporate such a back-asswards save system. Ruined it completely for me.

No offense, but that's inane. A save system is absolutely a design choice that is tied to difficulty and I don't see what Irrational did as a "step backward" so much as a deliberate choice meant to force players to complete certain sections in full, suffer full penalties for dying, etc. That IS about difficulty.

No, that's an archaic design choice from the NES days. We might as well bring back long, drawn-out passwords if that's the case. It's a step backwards in the series because the first two games have a fantastic, convenient, intuitive save system whereas Infinite does not.

[Ack]

How do you feel about the object-based save systems in games like Resident Evil, where even such a basic game mechanic became part of the limited resource system to heighten tension?

[Retrogamer0001]

How do you feel about the object-based save systems in games like Resident Evil, where even such a basic game mechanic became part of the limited resource system to heighten tension?

The original games on PS1? Love it, because I have control over where and when I save. That's the whole issue - lack of control.

[Luke]

But that's also the nature of playing a long, intricate video game - imagine if in the original Zelda on NES you couldn't save. .

I beat Ninja Gaiden, Castlevania, Blaster Master, Ghosts N Goblins, Super Ghouls n Ghosts every year, multiple times at that (usually). Check my games beaten list.

But your comment has nothing to do with I said. Save states DO make the game easier. Try beating some of the games I mentioned and tell me different.

[isiolia]

No offense, but that's inane. A save system is absolutely a design choice that is tied to difficulty and I don't see what Irrational did as a "step backward" so much as a deliberate choice meant to force players to complete certain sections in full, suffer full penalties for dying, etc. That IS about difficulty.

While I agree in general, I think completely leaving out manual saves is the wrong move. Utilizing organic challenge, like a trophy for limited saves, would be better.
Outside of actual bugs (I didn't experience what Luke mentioned either), I think mostly it's a complaint from PC gamers, because quick save/load are fairly standard features. As is saving when you want. Probably less due to intentional difficulty tuning, and more due to having faster, more expansive local storage standard well before consoles could hope to include it in a cost-effective manner.

I've also seen some complaints regarding support for multiple people saving different playthroughs. On a console, this would be less of an issue as both could have different profiles. On PC, it's a Steamworks title, so things aren't as simple (I guess now they have the family sharing). It'd be a non-issue if both just were able to make/name their own saves as they went.

[dsheinem]

A good or bad save system should have absolutely nothing to do with the difficulty of a game - that's basically like saying if a game has bad graphics or bad music, it only adds to the difficulty. It's a technical flaw, and was a major downgrade compared to the two older games in the series, and considering the state of gaming today, there really isn't any excuse to incorporate such a back-asswards save system. Ruined it completely for me.

No offense, but that's inane. A save system is absolutely a design choice that is tied to difficulty and I don't see what Irrational did as a "step backward" so much as a deliberate choice meant to force players to complete certain sections in full, suffer full penalties for dying, etc. That IS about difficulty.

No, that's an archaic design choice from the NES days. We might as well bring back long, drawn-out passwords if that's the case. It's a step backwards in the series because the first two games have a fantastic, convenient, intuitive save system whereas Infinite does not.

It's not that "archaic," it is a checkpoint system. Lots of games still use them, and I still hold that it is a deliberate design choice to NOT allow the player to save when they want. It may be inconvenient, but given that they had previously used a more "contemporary" save system in the earlier games you have to see this as a choice to up the difficulty of the game.

[Retrogamer0001]

But that's also the nature of playing a long, intricate video game - imagine if in the original Zelda on NES you couldn't save. .

I beat Ninja Gaiden, Castlevania, Blaster Master, Ghosts N Goblins, Super Ghouls n Ghosts every year, multiple times at that (usually). Check my games beaten list.

But your comment has nothing to do with I said. Save states DO make the game easier. Try beating some of the games I mentioned and tell me different.

No, save states make the game more convenient. Do you also hate saving any number of times in Super Metroid, Chrono Trigger, Super Mario World, FF6, etc? The list goes on forever and from the late NES days all the way to the current gen.

[dunpeal2064]

Save stating in a lot of those older NES games is akin to cheating.

I say this because, if you beat the game (lets say, Ninja Gaiden 3) with save states, you are most likely incapable of clearing the game.

You are using save states to adjust the difficulty. The deisgn choice is the same, but in reverse.

[noiseredux]

I've gotta be honest, I don't know what you guys are talking about regarding the save system. I beat the game in about a week, and don't remember having any issues with saving. What was the mess? Maybe I just don't recall, or maybe I didn't run into any it by luck.

When I would "Continue" I would be on a level I played days ago. And when you load a game, the load menu doesn't list levels by your progression. It was confusing to find out where you last left off.

This did not happen to me playing through on normal. Did you play it on the hardest difficulty - the one that was deliberately super-hardcore or whatever?

I never ran into this either. Dave, you and I played on PC. Luke played on 360. MAYBE the save system was different? (Seems strange if it was, but...)

[Retrogamer0001]

It's not that "archaic," it is a checkpoint system. Lots of games still use them, and I still hold that it is a deliberate design choice to NOT allow the player to save when they want. It may be inconvenient, but given that they had previously used a more "contemporary" save system in the earlier games you have to see this as a choice to up the difficulty of the game.

Have you played this game? I ask because the checkpoints do not save the game, only level exits and extrances do (or so it seems). I played for several hours at one point, hitting multiple checkpoints only to have to redo all that work after shutting off my system to take a break. Why? Ask the devs, because I sure as hell don't know.