SCHOOL UNIFORMS: Yay or Nay?

[Forlorn Drifter]

Dollar bill is just kind of a guideline, but its not often that its an issue, when it does come up, they send them to the office and check it, no shit. Our school is very picky about that stuff, seeing as the Vice Principal picks those things, and he is very conservative about dress.

The age bracket is about 14-18 or 19, about average for an American high school. Its never really caused many issues, hair dye outside of natural colors isn't at all popular here.

[Valkyrie-Favor]

I don't understand why hair color would be a big deal. Hard to argue that it disrupts class, and no one thinks hair dye is indecent anymore. My school even had rules for tattoos - anything is fine as long as it isn't obscene. Lots of teenage girls got lots of stupid tats

Teaching abstinence instead of "safe sex" is good, but hardly the best. I think the government and school system has no right to teach kids about sex at all. WTF? It's a completely private matter, best left to the family...though I found out when I was five, reading my grandpa' encyclopedia. Also, isn't it completely irresponsible to allow textbook companies or the government to form kids' opinions on these things?

[oxymoron]

No holes allowed in clothing unless below the knee in pants
all skirts/shorts for girls must be at least within a dollar bill length of the knee
all straps on shirts for girls must be at least three fingers wide

Is there some one measuring these things? Will a teacher take a dollar bill and send you home if your skirt is shorter than that?
I've only gone to a public school so I've never even heard of such weird regulations. I mean who uses dollar bills and finger lengths to measure things? Why are the rules so specific? I don't really care if they had a super strict protocol back when I went to school, but to me it sounds really weird that students can wear what hey want, PROVIDED IT'S AT LEAST WITHIN A DOLLAR BILL LENGTH OF THE KNEE

Although one time on 3rd or 4th grade I remember one kid got sent to home to change his clothes when it was like 9 or 10 degrees celsius and he was wearing a t-shirt and shorts

and hair must be a natural color.

This one seems quite strict, considering how popular hair coloring is amongst teenage girls. What's the age bracket of your school?

A dollar bill? Holy shit that's a small skirt. I can think of a few girls I'd love to see in that.

[Forlorn Drifter]

A dollar bill? Holy shit that's a small skirt. I can think of a few girls I'd love to see in that.

You know that's from the knee, right? Its not as small as you think it is, trust me.

[oxymoron]

A dollar bill? Holy shit that's a small skirt. I can think of a few girls I'd love to see in that.

You know that's from the knee, right? Its not as small as you think it is, trust me.

Oh. I was about to say that's pornstar shit.

[Menegrothx]

Also, isn't it completely irresponsible to allow textbook companies or the government to form kids' opinions on these things?

Because that is the ONLY issue where government has any influence on kids opinions Ever heard the phrase "history is written by winners"? Media, commercials, movies, most of the news, the school system, you are being taught to think in a certain way your whole life. You really think this one, fairly insignificant issue is going to have any effect on whether kids will grow up to be koolaid drinking sheeple or individualistic freedom warriors?

I personally dislike the current state of affairs and think that kids should be taught to be more abstinent and upright, but when you look at the statistics, they show that it doesn't work (abstinence in schools that is). The US has the highest teenage pregnancy rates of all 1st world countries, and the rates are the highest in conservative states, and lowest in liberal states. Bad, unprepared mothers=messed up children. Messed up children->more crime, lower education scores etc. It's in the best interest of the government to try to prevent that from happening as much as it can.

[Valkyrie-Favor]

You really think this one, fairly insignificant issue is going to have any effect on whether kids will grow up to be koolaid drinking sheeple or individualistic freedom warriors?

The US has the highest teenage pregnancy rates of all 1st world countries, and the rates are the highest in conservative states, and lowest in liberal states. Bad, unprepared mothers=messed up children. Messed up children->more crime, lower education scores etc.

What?

[Ivo]

This kind of grew a bit during the night.

Here are my takes on the alleged Pros by Luke's wife.

Pros:

1. Uniforms = uniformed. Not that every class or school is united, but there is without a doubt a sense of conformity and unity helps. There is no "My polo is better than yours". Kids wear the same clothes, and creates a bond.

2. (She also said that sometime that bond is: I hate these frigging clothes, but it still bonds them together).

3. It psychologically relieves stress from parents. You buy the outfit, and you are done. You don't have to worry about telling your kid his/her outfit of choice is dumb and expensive. The school does that for you.

4. Uniforms are cheap and provided for families in need. "It doesn't stop kids from getting into gangs, but in my eyes it has helped...a bit".

5. It helps teachers and students not have to worry about yearbook pictures. There is no stress on the students, teachers or the parents to make their kids "look the best of their class".

6. It provides better security during times of danger. Kids are easily identified.

7. It doesn't prevent bullying, but it does deter it to a certain degree.

1. Uniting a school or class under a uniform can then lead to territorial crap and an us vs them bullshit with other schools (just like bullshit with supporters of different sports teams)

2. I think encouraging kids to bond together over hate is a bad idea.

3. Agreed that this happens, I see it as de-responsibility parents for the education of their kids and encouraging them to pass the buck to school / teachers. We need less of that, not more.

4. I still disagree that uniforms are cheap, and we can go into the discussion of being subsidized or not (and whether they should be subsidized by all taxpayers, many of which don't even have kids). In my experience there can certainly be the issue mentioned by another poster where the uniforms are actually expensive. As for gangs, you are basically creating the same kind of territorial bullshit (see 1.) so I'm not surprised this helps suppress going into actual, dangerous gangs.

5. Something that happens once a year? People really make this such a big deal? The real solutions is getting over it, rather than "fixing" it with uniforms.

6. How so? Making kids easier to identify helps identifying kids. It could just as well highlight targets.

7. I already said that I think it is sad that this is used as a reason, and I don't really believe the uniforms help until I see rigorous study on it.

[Menegrothx]

What?

"isn't it completely irresponsible to allow textbook companies or the government to form kids' opinions on these things"
If you're concerned about the government influencing kids' world views/opinions, then it's utterly silly to get concerned over a minor issue like sex education, when it's just a drop in the large puddle that is 9+ years of compulsory public education. Especially when that particular issue serves a rational purpose, reducing the number of unwanted children and young women dropping out of school before they graduate.

[ZeroAX]

Cons:

Her answer was "I can't think of anything negative about uniforms, and my students don't wear them. My esl students already feel awkward due to not speaking English, and having something in common with other students would only be a positive.

Hmm. Students have hundreds of ways to display who they are...be it painting, drawing, art, or excelling at any particular skill. If they want to deal with the expletive deleted you (that's me) put up with, they can do that when they are adults. They are kids and need direction. Clothes have no factor in "who they are" when they have no clue "who they are".

She also said, "Kids usually hate everything they don't initially or have to put work into. As a teacher you need to put a tingle in the tooth or you show no authority".

I'm sorry but this just shows how much you refuse to compromise and how blinded you are from your own propaganda. I'm pretty much ready to accept that Uniforms have plenty of pros, and here you are refusing that it has ANY cons?

And why do you refuse so much the need for many kids to express themselves through their clothing? I repeat, I wear geeky and gamer shirts. I'm HAPPY to be wearing them. Yes some people have called me a dork, and others called me cool. That's life. If anything else, being picked on in school TAUGHT me that regardless of how much you try to fit in, the people who are fucked up themselves on the inside will keep trying to bring you down, so I've learned to just be myself enjoy life and not give a fuck about what others say, unless they are people who's opinion I really value.

Tell me how I'd learn that lesson if we all dressed exactly the same?