Metal Heads Assemble!!

[AppleQueso]

Metal elitism is pathetic.

I just knew this was coming.

You've never posted anything to indicate that you've bothered seriously exploring metal in depth beyond the most popular and mainstream acts. That big list you posted a while back of the bands you were into is proof of that.

If actually exploring the genre in depth and striving to gain an appreciation and understanding of what makes the genre what it is is makes me an "elitist," then I'll wear that tag proudly.

[BurningDoom]

Metal elitism is pathetic.

I just knew this was coming.

You've never posted anything to indicate that you've bothered seriously exploring metal in depth beyond the most popular and mainstream acts. That big list you posted a while back of the bands you were into is proof of that.

If actually exploring the genre in depth and striving to gain an appreciation and understanding of what makes the genre what it is is makes me an "elitist," then I'll wear that tag proudly.

That wasn't aimed at you, it was at Brunoafh who said flat out that Hair Metal isn't metal, which is complete BS.

And what, black metal, power metal, and melodic death metal isn't going outside of the mainstream?

My list wasn't "underground enough" for you? If that's the case, then I guess I do extend that aim to you too. Yeah, I do have a lot of mainstream bands on my list, but bands like Disarmonia Mundi, Dark Tranquility, Nightwish, Insomnium, Amorphis, and Children of Bodom are also on that list and get like zero mainstream attention. I enjoy ALL metal, not just Black Metal, or just Death Metal, or just whatever subgenre. That's a VERY limited way to sample metal.

[brunoafh]

No it's metal, without a doubt. It's your own limited view of metal that's getting in the way.

Humor me, how do you define metal? I would love to know.

[BurningDoom]

No it's metal, without a doubt. It's your own limited view of metal that's getting in the way.

Humor me, how do you define metal? I would love to know.

There's lots of different sub-genres that make up metal, and hair metal is a clearly defined and recognized subgenre. I think the real question here should be WHY DON'T YOU consider hair metal to be metal?

If you really believe that, then I think Dimebag "Diamond" Darrell would have a few words with you.

[BurningDoom]

No it's metal, without a doubt. It's your own limited view of metal that's getting in the way.

Humor me, how do you define metal? I would love to know.

There's lots of different sub-genres that make up metal, and hair metal/glam metal is a clearly defined and recognized subgenre. I think the real question here should be WHY DON'T YOU consider hair metal to be metal?

If you really believe that, then I think Dimebag "Diamond" Darrell would have a few words with you.

[AppleQueso]

That wasn't aimed at you, it was at Brunoafh who said flat out that Hair Metal isn't metal, which is complete BS.

And what, black metal, power metal, and melodic death metal isn't going outside of the mainstream?

My list wasn't "underground enough" for you? If that's the case, then I guess I do extend that aim to you too. Yeah, I do have a lot of mainstream bands on my list, but bands like Disarmonia Mundi, Dark Tranquility, Nightwish, Insomnium, Amorphis, and Children of Bodom are also on that list and get like zero mainstream attention. I enjoy ALL metal, not just Black Metal, or just Death Metal, or just whatever subgenre. That's a VERY limited way to sample metal.

They get a lot more wide exposure than you might realize. Shit just taking Children of Bodom as an example, Alexi Laiho is plastered all over guitar magazines (or at least he was a few years ago, I haven't looked in a while.) Nightwish are absolutely huge, even my friggin' cousin is into them. Dark Tranquility are one of the "big three" of Melodic Death (along with At The Gates and In Flames). I could go on, but the point I'm trying to make is that these bands are all actually very popular. Some of it might be considered "underground," but it's very "entry level" stuff.

If that observation makes me elitist, oh well.

I'm not sure where you get the idea that we only sample specific subgenres, because that's not the case at all.

...but you can like what you want. Nothing against that, you go enjoy yourself.

No it's metal, without a doubt. It's your own limited view of metal that's getting in the way.

Humor me, how do you define metal? I would love to know.

There's lots of different sub-genres that make up metal, and hair metal/glam metal is a clearly defined and recognized subgenre. I think the real question here should be WHY DON'T YOU consider hair metal to be metal?

If you really believe that, then I think Dimebag "Diamond" Darrell would have a few words with you.

Hair metal isn't a "clearly defined and recognized subgenre," it's an umbrella term describing a wide variety of (mostly American) bands with a particular image. It encompasses some legit heavy metal acts (WASP), and it encompasses some rock acts like Poison.

-

I don't know about you, but I am absolutely sick of this discussion at this point. All I was trying to do was point out that Metal is still healthy, and Burningdoom wanted to harp on about the 80s.

[Forlorn Drifter]

And judging from this discussion, I think I may be the only hair metal fan here.

Well, I like hair metal too. But I will say that it covers such a large variety of bands it sometimes doesn't make it to the metal level. Motley Crue or W.A.S.P. make the cut no issue, where as bands like Whitesnake or Cinderella don't seem to make the metal cut to me.

I have to agree with Queso though, you're tastes are on the more mainstream end of things man. That isn't a bad thing, but you have to take things into consideration. I think melodeath is highly popular right now, as it has been. By any metalheads consideration, it is mainstream. I mean, I listen to melodeath, and I'm at the point that I don't like growls that much anymore. Doesn't that seem to say something?


And if we're going to argue about genres, lets get down to the nitty gritty. Where do Blue Cheer, Blue Oyster Cult, Cream, and certain other early leaders fit? Sir Lord Baltimore is considered metal, so why not some of these?

[AppleQueso]

And if we're going to argue about genres, lets get down to the nitty gritty. Where do Blue Cheer, Blue Oyster Cult, Cream, and certain other early leaders fit? Sir Lord Baltimore is considered metal, so why not some of these?

Yeah I don't know. It's been years since I've listened to any of those particular bands, and IDK about Sir Lord Baltimore. Metal wasn't very well defined back then, and didn't really get a particular, definitive "sound" until at least the mid 70s I'd say. Probably around when Judas Priest was really picking up steam.

Apparently, Sir Lord Baltimore was the first band to ever be described as "Heavy metal" in a review. Interesting!

If Black Sabbath started metal, I'd say Judas Priest codified it. Everything imo else should fall into that vein. The early history of metal is pretty fascinating to me though. Many of the 70s bands were really cool.

[Forlorn Drifter]

Well, I've gotten into the very early stuff a bit more too, because a lot of blogs that cover doom metal also cover the more groovy old school stuff, along with delving into stoner rock, acid rock, and the like.

You know how you mentioned that a lot of NWOBHM didn't get past one release? A lot of stuff from back then didn't either. There's a certain one I'm looking for as an example, but I can't find it... the band and album name were very similar. Dark by Darkness, if I remember correctly. It only got released in the last year or two, but was recorded back then. Its a case where the album is only one 45 minute song or some such. It was very interesting.

[AppleQueso]

Well, I've gotten into the very early stuff a bit more too, because a lot of blogs that cover doom metal also cover the more groovy old school stuff, along with delving into stoner rock, acid rock, and the like.

You know how you mentioned that a lot of NWOBHM didn't get past one release? A lot of stuff from back then didn't either. There's a certain one I'm looking for as an example, but I can't find it... the band and album name were very similar. Dark by Darkness, if I remember correctly. It only got released in the last year or two, but was recorded back then. Its a case where the album is only one 45 minute song or some such. It was very interesting.

Oh yeah there's a lot of cases of stuff like that happening. It's always cool when you see a band finally get their album out after like 30 years of waiting.