The VGA is BS

[winds]

Not everyone is as knowledgable about the market as us gamers/collectors though. And it doesn't necessarily have to influence cart only copies to escalate the price. I could sell my CIB copy using the VGA grades as a metric, why not? My copy is mint and "only used once", the only difference is his has a plastic seal and a number on it. Then my inflated price could be used as a metric for the next seller with the loose cart version, and why not? His copy is only missing some box no one cares about, it still has the "meat".

Like I said it's a cycle that turns dirt cheap games into more expensive games.

And thanks Ack, that example is exactly what i'm trying to illustrate.

I doubt we'll convince each other though, let's just agree to disagree, haha.

[AppleQueso]

I may have exaggerated the impact a little. I didn't mean people suddenly sell their game for exactly the same prices as the VGA auctions. I only meant that it absolutely influences the next sellers asking price, so he's going to compare it to that one. Seeing as how most of these auctions are resellers who've an ebay store, they can afford to let it sit there until some desperate buyer is willing to pay for it to complete or further their collection.

It is such an easy cycle that inflates $10 games to $40 or $50. Or even more extreme in some cases.

VGA graded stuff sits at prices so far above what anyone could imagine as being reasonable that I can't imagine anybody trying to use them as a metric for how they should price loose carts.

Here's a complete copy of Aero Fighters that has at least been opened for testing going for about $2500.00. It is marked used:

http://item.ebay.com/330873021874

Here's another copy in "acceptable" condition, cart only, going for $547.97.

http://item.ebay.com/290833208904

It's possible that people saw the price on a VGA rated copy of Aero Fighters and set their like new copy at $2500, which caused the used game only copy to go for over $500.

There's not even a VGA graded copy of the game on ebay right now, and that CIB copy hasn't even sold.

I'm sorry but all you've convinced me of is that expensive games are expensive. I don't see anything compelling to suggest that VGA has somehow affected prices on non-sealed games.

[Ack]

[quote="Ack]
Here's a complete copy of Aero Fighters that has at least been opened for testing going for about $2500.00. It is marked used:

http://item.ebay.com/330873021874

Here's another copy in "acceptable" condition, cart only, going for $547.97.

http://item.ebay.com/290833208904

It's possible that people saw the price on a VGA rated copy of Aero Fighters and set their like new copy at $2500, which caused the used game only copy to go for over $500.

There's not even a VGA graded copy of the game on ebay right now, and that CIB copy hasn't even sold.

I'm sorry but all you've convinced me of is that expensive games are expensive. I don't see anything compelling to suggest that VGA has somehow affected prices on non-sealed games.[/quote][/quote]

It's cool. Unfortunately the only two new copies to have sold on eBay in the last five years were in 2009 and 2011, so the auctions' data has long expired. These are all of the completed auctions in the last few years for used copies:

http://videogames.pricecharting.com/gam ... d-auctions

And these are all the completed new auctions:

http://videogames.pricecharting.com/gam ... ctions-new

Honestly, there is a pretty wide fluctuation in the price of various auctions that this game has gone through in recent years. $150-$450 about, so why it now has jumped up to $550-ish for a heavily used copy and $2500 for a like new copy seems almost arbitrary. I'm acknowledging that perhaps a VGA graded copy was used as a basis, though in truth we can only speculate, especially since we can't access the old auction data.

[8bit]

On a side note to this topic. Arrogant as it may seem I wish sellers who posted on craigslist or flea markets didn't even know about eBay at all. If you want ebay prices, go sell it on ebay! If I wanted to pay eBay prices, I'd be shopping on eBay! Someone telling me what something goes for on eBay when someone is sitting in a parking lot all afternoon trying to sell stuff is idiotic to me.

[mjmjr25]

VGA, meh, is what it is, but it shouldn't be argued that they are the authority to those who are involved in that niche market. So far no one is biting at my offer to entomb and grade their games.

What you all should care about is that if you do have a sealed game that is moderately sought after, it would behoove you to have it graded. S1mple can elaborate on this particular story, he had a copy of DK 64, sealed and minty. Sold it for like $110 to "rarelucky". "rarelucky", sealed game buyer, is also, "rarebucky", sealed game seller. Two weeks after selling the game, it was on ebay, graded an 85 silver, and selling for $500. Not sure what it sold for exactly since it was marked as "sold, best offer accepted" but safe to say it was at least $400+ as that seller usually auto-declines offers less than 75% of list of buy now price. So that $25 or so investment to have it graded (the price goes down the more games you have graded) turnes into $250+ profit after the grading and ebay paypal fees.

As for VGPC, they are "mostly" accurate, the issue is that they do not take into account condition or whether it is working or not, etc.

As an example:
Battlezone, Rise of the Black Dogs - N64
loose cart sells on ebay for $7
loose cart sells on ebay for $9
loose cart, bad label, sells on ebay for $3
loose cart, bad label, not working, sells for $0.01 on ebay
VGPC prices it at $4.75, but really a nice label working copy should be priced at $8

Now, lets add more variables, which VGPC doesn't take into account:
loose cart sells on ebay for $7
loose cart sells on ebay for $9
loose cart, bad label, sells on ebay for $3
loose cart, bad label, not working, sells for $0.01 on ebay
cart, nice label, wrinkled and worn manual sells for $40
cart, nice label, nice manual sells for $55
cart, nice label, nice manual, worn box sells for $110
cart, nice label, nice manual, nice box sells for $170
loose cart sells on ebay $8
loose cart sells on ebay $11
loose cart sells on ebay $7
Now VGPC lists this game at $38.19

As much as VGPC may try to use filters, it simply can't take into account things that aren't mentioned in title listing, things that are spelled wrong, things that aren't in the main title listing, but are in the body listing and the photos.

I'm not saying VGPC is bad...not at all. It is a GREAT tool and can be used as a nice barometer, but I wouldn't recommend anyone price their games based on what VGPC says is the current value. Rather, ebay completed listings are absolutely your best guage as you are able to see what sold, what didn't sell, and at what price. More importantly, you can (in most cases) see condition of the cart / disc / label / manual / box / case, etc that contributed to that higher or lower than expected price.

[Nintendork666]

Look at Metal Warriors for SNES, or King of Dragons. I remember seeing those on ebay 2 years ago for dirt cheap. Now they're seemingly the "holy grail" of SNES collecting in sellers eyes.

Wow!! Metal Warriors shot up there! I'm gonna have to convince my cousin to loan me his never-played-anymore copy.

Same goes for Kirby Superstar (used to own, traded off) and even the first Mega Man X. Not as high as Metal Warriors, but still. That's what I get for slacking off on SNES carts... shit.

[winds]

S1mple can elaborate on this particular story, he had a copy of DK 64, sealed and minty. Sold it for like $110 to "rarelucky". "rarelucky", sealed game buyer, is also, "rarebucky", sealed game seller. Two weeks after selling the game, it was on ebay, graded an 85 silver, and selling for $500.

I know the guy you're talking about (not personally, but I see him post on certain forums, and have seen numerous VGA items in his ebay store).

That is exactly the kind of behavior i'm talking about that really gets on my nerves. But who is in the wrong here? VGA for offering this service that they know resellers take advantage of? The reseller for taking advantage of the market? Or the buyers who shell out such ridiculous cash for a game that should be worth a 5th of that asking price? In my mind it's mostly the buyers (with a bit of fault on the resellers, he couldn't pay it forward just a little bit and sell it only for a little profit?? I mean come on, that guys a collector too, he's ruining his own market with such practices).

Anyways, that's the kind of stuff that really gets under my skin in the collecting scene. I didn't realize 5 years ago we all had it so much better. I still remember when $50 for an snes game was expensive. Now that's the deal of the century.

[k.vlaros]

I really, really like VGA. I've spent a lot of money on VGA'd games. VGA collecting probably does have an effect on sealed collecting but certainly has little to no effect on loose or opened CIB collecting. The VGA is leveraging years of experience grading action figures (and their packaging) as the AFA. If you don't "get" sealed collecting, you certainly won't "get" the VGA.

And as a random comment, most of the more expensive VGA listing have a 'make an offer' and anyone serious about buying will utilize it. Being enraged (bemused, indignant- whatever you think you are) over the BIN on any listing with an OBO is misplaced.

I see most of the upset feelings towards the VGA as envy over other peoples' dispossable income and value priorities.

[winds]

I totally "get" sealed collecting. I even used to collect sealed games. I don't do it anymore though, and in fact steer clear of sealed games altogether because at this time I would just open it, and I don't think that's fair to the sealed collecting community.

My feelings towards VGA aren't that of enragement, in fact it's a great medium for sealed collectors to get their treasures graded - IF the purpose is to keep it in their collection for their own satisfaction. If the only purpose of them grading their games is to jack up the resale value and list it on ebay for 5x the price - then that's something I take issue with. Of course they have all the right in the world to do it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't hurts other collectors all the more in the end.

Having an OBO is a nice feature as well on ebay, but again if a game is usually worth $100, and some seller has it listed at VGA graded for $500. Most likely he's not going to settle for $100, but instead wait for a slightly below BIN offer that just inflated the market value of that game, whether it's VGA graded, CIB, loose, or anything in between. Those "auctions" have a ripple effect.

[MrPopo]

My feelings towards VGA aren't that of enragement, in fact it's a great medium for sealed collectors to get their treasures graded - IF the purpose is to keep it in their collection for their own satisfaction. If the only purpose of them grading their games is to jack up the resale value and list it on ebay for 5x the price - then that's something I take issue with.

What's the purpose of grading something you're only going to keep for yourself? To me the whole point of grading is to get a set of parameters with which you can use to accurately price something.