Making piracy right

[Hobie-wan]

This thread pretty much took exactly the direction that everyone expected it to.

how boring

I could Godwin the thread so we could put it out of it's misery. We all know it will die soon anyway, right? Lemme see...

On the other hand, I live in a country where no one ever will be judged for pirating.

Oh, well then. In Nazi Germany the power in charge was totally cool with hating Jews so if you were a murderous asshole you could go around killing them and not only not be judged. Hey, one might have even been looked upon fondly. That makes it ok, right?

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How's that ManzanaQueso? Maybe we'll be done with incarnation of pointless talking that never goes anywhere because we all just say the same thing every damn time.

[aaron]

2)I will have to add that iTunes forces you to buy Apple TV to able to watch the show on your TV. Another disadvantage.

there are dozens of ways to display what is on your computer screen on your TV.

[o.pwuaioc]

Oh, well then. In Nazi Germany the power in charge was totally cool with hating Jews so if you were a murderous asshole you could go around killing them and not only not be judged. Hey, one might have even been looked upon fondly. That makes it ok, right?

Except, who is he hurting?

In reality i wanted to meet half way , where the boxset will be priced reasonably , say $30 . I get an original boxset and the creator , say he makes a million in sales , will make a cool $30m . Or he can keep his imaginary $240, no one will buy the boxset, and I still get to see the show.

Considering that show probably cost 3 million an episode, and the show has 23 episodes a season. That 30 million on DVD sales covers half of a season to make.

All in all $30 for a 23 episode season on dvd is not bad.

If the show was popular enough, it made it all back in advertisement sales while it ran. The DVD sales are cash cows, but they generally aren't used to make up for the expenses incurred.

[Hobie-wan]

Except, who is he hurting?

Taking something that one wasn't entitled to. Life, entertainment, what's the difference when one is trying to Godwin the thread so we can stop saying the shit we always say at each other every.damn.time?

Maybe I should just say "We've already got a thread for that" and link this with a previous one that's already been locked.

[o.pwuaioc]

Except, who is he hurting?

Taking something that one wasn't entitled to. Life, entertainment, what's the difference when one is trying to Godwin the thread so we can stop saying the shit we always say at each other every.damn.time?

Maybe I should just say "We've already got a thread for that" and link this with a previous one that's already been locked.

Good point. I was trying to counter your Godwinism, but I guess to no avail. This really has been done a thousand times before. Would one day like a real conversation about this topic that isn't just spouting off moralist bullshit or entitlement issues, using — you know — those pesky little things called facts.

[Ivo]

Except, who is he hurting?

(...) so we can stop saying the shit we always say at each other every.damn.time?

Maybe I should just say "We've already got a thread for that" and link this with a previous one that's already been locked.

Good point. I was trying to counter your Godwinism, but I guess to no avail. This really has been done a thousand times before. Would one day like a real conversation about this topic that isn't just spouting off moralist bullshit or entitlement issues, using — you know — those pesky little things called facts.

I think you are being unfair here. The thread was actually rather specific and not really discussing morals or opinions that much - to my understanding the purpose was to discuss alternative means of supporting the creators in a way that approaches "pay what you want". If that makes it right or not needs not be discussed - it is obvious that when we go there we are going to get moralists and rationalizations.

But if someone is going to pirate anyway, lets start with that as an assumption, then I think there is room to discuss such alternative means of supporting the creators. That is sort of like a game in itself, with limited available possibilities trying to find ways to "pay what you want" for certain amount of content through a combination of piracy and actually buying some part of that content (or even other) content.

Of course some people said "don't bother, just pirate" or "you are overthinking it, just pirate", which does not fill the purpose. Some others said "you should not pirate, period", which again does not fill the purpose. Few actually came out with helpful suggestions (such as go watch musicians live etc.).

If you really want to stop what is said every time, then I think warning the posters that were missing the purpose (perhaps including myself on later posts) would make more sense than locking the thread.

[o.pwuaioc]

But if someone is going to pirate anyway, lets start with that as an assumption, then I think there is room to discuss such alternative means of supporting the creators. Some people said "don't bother" or "you are overthinking it", which does not fill the purpose. Some others said "you should not pirate, period", which again does not fill the purpose.

It was those two positions that I was criticizing, not op's question.

[pakopako]

I was going to say, I haven't been here in a year and this all still looks very familiar.

But then again, it is nice to let it all out every now and then.

[fastbilly1]

In reality i wanted to meet half way , where the boxset will be priced reasonably , say $30 . I get an original boxset and the creator , say he makes a million in sales , will make a cool $30m . Or he can keep his imaginary $240, no one will buy the boxset, and I still get to see the show.

Considering that show probably cost 3 million an episode, and the show has 23 episodes a season. That 30 million on DVD sales covers half of a season to make.

All in all $30 for a 23 episode season on dvd is not bad.

If the show was popular enough, it made it all back in advertisement sales while it ran. The DVD sales are cash cows, but they generally aren't used to make up for the expenses incurred.

I am fully aware, he just was looking for a reason why DVDs cost so much. Most people dont realize how much shows cost, and while they DVDs are often cashcows, they do sometimes spur creation of more seasons, Futurama for example.

[Ivo]

I think there is an important clash here. If a content creator wants to get advertising money, then to some extent he will offer the content for a lower price (of free) to some consumers because that garners more viewers (and consequently exposes more viewers to the advertising).

In cases like TV series where they are aiming mostly for advertising cash and it was accessible to e.g. the U.S. audience for free, I really don't blame people e.g. outside the U.S. from not feeling ethically challenged when pirating it.

In these and other cases, content creators would probably do well to follow the GOG model for a secondary revenue choice:
Offer convenience and price the content relatively low, instead of offering the content at relatively high prices and often in ways that are actually less convenient than pirating it (!).
It is the creator / publisher right to choose not to follow that model of course, but it really seems to make sense from a market point of view. That would give them access to people like Kingmohd, who actually do want to contribute towards the creators.
That doesn't mean people are right in pirating the content...

While the content creators insist in not making the effort to meet half-way (which is their right to do so), I think Kingmohd and others that want to support the creators, but not at "full price", should be encouraged to be creative with their solutions. Simply telling them to not pirate at all instead is probably encountering a similar barrier at being an effective strategy as telling people in countries with huge prevalence of AIDS to not have sex, instead of encouraging them to use condoms (perhaps that is a crappy comparison).

Given the options you have at your country, you should be able to find some way to actually pay for part of the content if you want to. Many options were discussed in the thread.

Ivo.