Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rights

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J T
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Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rights

Post by J T »

UUGG!!! AAAAAAGGGGHHHH!!! #@#$%!!!!

Valve. I thought you were better than this. I really did. Fuck.

I updated Steam today, which brought up a new "Subscriber Agreement" that I have to sign in order to log into Steam now. I clicked that I "Disagree" with the statement and now I can't play my 600+ games on Steam until I say I "Agree".

Behind the spoiler is the portion of the agreement I hate and do not want to sign.

12. DISPUTE RESOLUTION/BINDING ARBITRATION/CLASS ACTION WAIVER.

Most user concerns can be resolved by use of our Steam support site at https://support.steampowered.com/. If we are unable to resolve your concerns and a dispute remains between you and Valve, this Section explains how we agree to resolve it.

YOU AND VALVE AGREE TO RESOLVE ALL DISPUTES AND CLAIMS BETWEEN US IN INDIVIDUAL BINDING ARBITRATION. THAT INCLUDES, BUT IS NOT LIMITED TO, ANY CLAIMS ARISING OUT OF OR RELATING TO: (i) ANY ASPECT OF THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN US; (ii) THIS AGREEMENT; OR (iii) YOUR USE OF STEAM, YOUR ACCOUNT OR THE SOFTWARE. IT APPLIES REGARDLESS OF WHETHER SUCH CLAIMS ARE BASED IN CONTRACT, TORT, STATUTE, FRAUD, UNFAIR COMPETITION, MISREPRESENTATION OR ANY OTHER LEGAL THEORY.

However, this Section does not apply to the following types of claims or disputes, which you or Valve may bring in any court with jurisdiction: (i) claims of infringement or other misuse of intellectual property rights, including such claims seeking injunctive relief; and (ii) claims related to or arising from any alleged unauthorized use, piracy or theft.

This Section does not prevent you from bringing your dispute to the attention of any federal, state, or local government agencies that can, if the law allows, seek relief from us for you.

An arbitration is a proceeding before a neutral arbitrator, instead of before a judge or jury. Arbitration is less formal than a lawsuit in court, and provides more limited discovery. It follows different rules than court proceedings, and is subject to very limited review by courts. The arbitrator will issue a written decision and provide a statement of reasons if requested by either party. YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU AND VALVE ARE GIVING UP THE RIGHT TO SUE IN COURT AND TO HAVE A TRIAL BEFORE A JUDGE OR JURY.

You and Valve agree to make reasonable, good faith efforts to informally resolve any dispute before initiating arbitration. A party who intends to seek arbitration must first send the other a written notice that describes the nature and basis of the claim or dispute and sets forth the relief sought. If you and Valve do not reach an agreement to resolve that claim or dispute within 30 days after the notice is received, you or Valve may commence an arbitration. Written notice to Valve must be sent via postal mail to: ATTN: Arbitration Notice, Valve Corporation, P.O. Box 1688, Bellevue, WA 98004.

The Federal Arbitration Act applies to this Section. The arbitration will be governed by the Commercial Arbitration Rules of the American Arbitration Association (“AAA”) and, where applicable, the AAA’s Supplementary Procedures for Consumer Related Disputes, as modified by this Agreement, both of which are available at http://www.adr.org. The arbitrator is bound by the terms of this Agreement.

The AAA will administer the arbitration. It may be conducted through the submission of documents, by phone, or in person in the county where you live or at another mutually agreed location.

If you seek $10,000 or less, Valve agrees to reimburse your filing fee and your share of the arbitration costs, including your share of arbitrator compensation, at the conclusion of the proceeding, unless the arbitrator determines your claims are frivolous or costs are unreasonable as determined by the arbitrator. Valve agrees not to seek its attorneys' fees or costs in arbitration unless the arbitrator determines your claims are frivolous or costs are unreasonable as determined by the arbitrator. If you seek more than $10,000, the arbitration costs, including arbitrator compensation, will be split between you and Valve according to the AAA Commercial Arbitration Rules and the AAA’s Supplementary Procedures for Consumer Related Disputes, if applicable.

YOU AND VALVE AGREE NOT TO BRING OR PARTICIPATE IN A CLASS OR REPRESENTATIVE ACTION, PRIVATE ATTORNEY GENERAL ACTION OR COLLECTIVE ARBITRATION, EVEN IF AAA’s PROCEDURES OR RULES WOULD OTHERWISE ALLOW ONE. THE ARBITRATOR MAY AWARD RELIEF ONLY IN FAVOR OF THE INDIVIDUAL PARTY SEEKING RELIEF AND ONLY TO THE EXTENT OF THAT PARTY’S INDIVIDUAL CLAIM. You and Valve also agree not to seek to combine any action or arbitration with any other action or arbitration without the consent of all parties to this Agreement and all other actions or arbitrations.

If the agreement in this Section not to bring or participate in a class or representative action, private attorney general action or collective arbitration should be found illegal or unenforceable, you and Valve agree that it shall not be severable, that this entire Section shall be unenforceable and any claim or dispute would be resolved in court and not in collective arbitration.

Notwithstanding this Section, you have the right to litigate any dispute in small claims court, if all the requirements of the small claims court, including any limitations on jurisdiction and the amount at issue in the dispute, are satisfied.

This Section 12 shall apply to the maximum extent permitted by applicable law. If the laws of your jurisdiction prohibit the application of some or all of the provisions of this Section notwithstanding Section 11 (Applicable Law/Jurisdiction), such provisions will not apply to you.
Now I know that I'm not terribly likely to need to file a class action lawsuit against Valve, but I don't really care to sign away my right to do so and it pisses me off that they are holding my games ransom until I will sign off on this. :evil:
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Erik_Twice
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by Erik_Twice »

J T wrote:Valve. I thought you were better than this. I really did. Fuck.
Same here. And the fact that you need to agree or you won't see your games is just assininine.

But I shouldn't be surprised because the laws on this kind of thing sucks. Sure, we Europeans are outside this because of a recent ruling but really, what a bunch of assholes.

Anyways, this is the typical bullshit we see everywhere. Facebook, telephone operators selling your personal info...all bullshit allowed by the State.
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dsheinem
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by dsheinem »

When Sony did it = widespread gamer outrage and resentment, people getting rid of or hacking PS3s, lots of righteous indignation.

When Valve did it = a day or two of gamers going "grrr, that sucks. fucking nazis. oh well....'click.'"

The same thing happened with Sony/Valve with incidents of account hacking, downtime problems, etc. The double standard is hilarious.
gtmtnbiker
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by gtmtnbiker »

I'm not sure what the big deal is. It just means that if you have a dispute, you will need to go before a private arbitrator instead of the court system. It's just a way to reduce the legal costs for both sides. It doesn't mean that the arbitrator will rubber stamp all decisions in favor of Valve.
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jfrost
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by jfrost »

I don't even think they have the right to demand that, anywhere.

Anyway, I didn't have to agree to that either.
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isiolia
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by isiolia »

dsheinem wrote:When Sony did it = widespread gamer outrage and resentment, people getting rid of or hacking PS3s, lots of righteous indignation.

When Valve did it = a day or two of gamers going "grrr, that sucks. fucking nazis. oh well....'click.'"

The same thing happened with Sony/Valve with incidents of account hacking, downtime problems, etc. The double standard is hilarious.
I think part of the difference is that in Valve's case, they force you to give up pursuing a class action...but clearly state that not only can you still bring up an individual case against them, but they'll pay for the costs up to $10k.
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noiseredux
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by noiseredux »

isiolia wrote: I think part of the difference is that in Valve's case, they force you to give up pursuing a class action...but clearly state that not only can you still bring up an individual case against them, but they'll pay for the costs up to $10k.
and the other part of the difference is that Sony is an unstoppable evil force that wants to destroy gaming from the inside out whereas Valve are some cool buds who throw the sickest parties and make games for fun rather than profit.
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wip3outguy7
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by wip3outguy7 »

...and once again people mistook a company for a living, breathing entity with feelings, values and a moral sense...
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Luke
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by Luke »

^That's how I feel about it as well. A company needs to protect their own ass. Almost surprised that wasn't part of the initial agreement.

Reminds me of the Simpsons:

"The Al ighty ollar"
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Gunstar Green
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Re: Latest Steam update forces you to give up your legal rig

Post by Gunstar Green »

The digital future of gaming is a cold, dark place indeed.

At the end of the day though this probably won't effect anyone. I hope.
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