any dragonball z fans in here?

[Flak Beard]

Those 13 episodes are actually the only decent ones you'll find in the GT series. Past that, the story just gets so fucking retarded, with a brand new super ultra mega lord of the fucking multiverse big boss character every 2-3 episodes, always stronger than the previous one. Everyone of them felt like a rejected character concept. I do not recommend this show.

Yeah, it really fell apart after the first saga in GT. I couldn't bring myself to watch anything past Super 17.

[aaron]

the scene during frieza where vegeta is crying and admitting all of his wrongdoings to goku has seriously made me cry multiple times.

but what do i know, the first pokémon movie makes me cry, too.

[grittykitty]

but what do i know, the first pokémon movie makes me cry, too.

niiiiiiiiice. when it first came out, my best friend and i were sneaking around the movie theater and we walked in on it. knowing the theater would be full of kids, my friend yells out "show us your boobs!" when misty was on screen. good times.

as for dragonball z, i was a pretty die hard fan shortly after it first got released in english. i had nothing but the dubs for a while, until i found some low quality fan-sub bootlegs that an anime shop downtown was renting out. i copied these copies-of-copies-of-copies and watched them with my friends and we never went back to english dubs. i agree that the series took a turn for the worst after the freeza saga, and that's when i quickly lost interest. by the time the merchandising really took off, i was pretty disgusted. i went back to the original dragon ball a few years ago when funimation began releasing all the episodes past the original 12 (with the horrible editing and cheesy voice acting) and i loved it. i used to buy the new issues of the viz-published english version comic book when it came out every month, but around the turn of the century i almost completely lost interest.

the series itself can be boring and hard to follow, but i love the feature films! the sixth dbz one (with metal cooler) and the 8th movie (broly's second coming) are still my favorites. i whole-heartedly recommend them not only to dragonball z fans, but to anime fans in general.

[Flak Beard]

niiiiiiiiice. when it first came out, my best friend and i were sneaking around the movie theater and we walked in on it. knowing the theater would be full of kids, my friend yells out "show us your boobs!" when misty was on screen. good times.

Me and two of my friends went to see one of the Pokemon movies at the theater. It was full of soccer moms and kids, with us being the only dudes in their early twenties. I can't remember which exact movie it was, as I wasn't really into Pokemon at the time and was talked into going by my friend. Anyway, there was a part in the movie where one of the characters was like "Shhhh... do you hear that?". The movie went silent and the whole theater was quiet. My friend decided to seize the opportunity, and ripped the loudest and nastiest fart I've ever heard. The kids were laughing, but the parents were not amused. It was rancid too, so it made the whole thing even more awesome.

[aaron]

but what do i know, the first pokémon movie makes me cry, too.

niiiiiiiiice. when it first came out, my best friend and i were sneaking around the movie theater and we walked in on it. knowing the theater would be full of kids, my friend yells out "show us your boobs!" when misty was on screen. good times.

in all honesty, the end of that movie is one of the most emotionally trying circumstances for a child to be presented with.



seriously, your best friend is turned to stone (effectively killed) trying to protect you and you are trying as hard as you can to save him but no matter what you do it just isn't good enough. the noise that pikachu is making is so desperate and filled with anguish, it's seriously heart-wrenching.

fuck you guys.

[Mozgus]

but what do i know, the first pokémon movie makes me cry, too.

niiiiiiiiice. when it first came out, my best friend and i were sneaking around the movie theater and we walked in on it. knowing the theater would be full of kids, my friend yells out "show us your boobs!" when misty was on screen. good times.

in all honesty, the end of that movie is one of the most emotionally trying circumstances for a child to be presented with.



seriously, your best friend is turned to stone (effectively killed) trying to protect you and you are trying as hard as you can to save him but no matter what you do it just isn't good enough. the noise that pikachu is making is so desperate and filled with anguish, it's seriously heart-wrenching.

fuck you guys.

Haha oh my god, sorry but that clip is hilarious.

Also, Pokemon + some actual animation = not bad.

[aaron]

i will admit it goes downhill when the rest of the pokemon start crying.

[Doctor Fugue]

I would rather watch bad anime than most american TV shows but I guess I don't get the whimsy or charm people see in this. The DBZ/Pokemon/Naruto/Fullmetal Alchemist/Yu-Gi-Oh/One Piece group are all good anime, although their longevity becomes a burden. I don't think it is too childish at all; just too repetitive to stay interesting.

And that's what I don't get. People love these formulaic fight/lose/fight/win anime but then dismiss other genres of anime as copy-cat shows when they are nothing alike. I find there is much more variety and inventiveness in anime and manga than anything I've seen coming from the States. Tone, pacing, character development, story arcs, dialog, intensity, climax, emotion...every aspect is quite different depending on the genre of anime.

I'm not saying DBZ and Naruto are bad, and I actually think Bleach is a great part of that Shonen Jump lineage which probably began with FotNS, but it surprises me that really only one kind of anime is popular in North America. I've already mentioned a few different anime that I like in another thread (Ergo Proxy, Death Note, Fate/Stay Night), but how about people showing some love for all kinds of TV anime: Elfen Lied, Beck: Mongolian Chop Squad, Samurai X, Evangelion, Code Geass, Clannad, The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, Nodame Cantabile, Gurren Lagann, Shakugan no Shana, Claymore, the list is pretty well endless.

Wow, sorry to go off like that. All this DBZ talk got me going again.

[Mozgus]

I would rather watch bad anime than most american TV shows but I guess I don't get the whimsy or charm people see in this. The DBZ/Pokemon/Naruto/Fullmetal Alchemist/Yu-Gi-Oh/One Piece group are all good anime, although their longevity becomes a burden. I don't think it is too childish at all; just too repetitive to stay interesting.

And that's what I don't get. People love these formulaic fight/lose/fight/win anime but then dismiss other genres of anime as copy-cat shows when they are nothing alike. I find there is much more variety and inventiveness in anime and manga than anything I've seen coming from the States. Tone, pacing, character development, story arcs, dialog, intensity, climax, emotion...every aspect is quite different depending on the genre of anime.

I'm not saying DBZ and Naruto are bad, and I actually think Bleach is a great part of that Shonen Jump lineage which probably began with FotNS, but it surprises me that really only one kind of anime is popular in North America. I've already mentioned a few different anime that I like in another thread (Ergo Proxy, Death Note, Fate/Stay Night), but how about people showing some love for all kinds of TV anime: Elfen Lied, Beck: Mongolian Chop Squad, Samurai X, Evangelion, Code Geass, Clannad, The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, Nodame Cantabile, Gurren Lagann, Shakugan no Shana, Claymore, the list is pretty well endless.

Wow, sorry to go off like that. All this DBZ talk got me going again.

How can you claim anime is superior to anything in the states, and I'm assuming you mean anything natively english? You list "Tone, pacing, character development, story arcs, dialog, intensity, climax, emotion", but practically all of those are superior in english based shows, and not just in cartoons, but that's what I'll compare to in order to stay relevant.

I stick to adult swim these days because I don't care to go hunting for anything really exotic or indie to watch. I'm so glad that they have finally put anime in the backseat. It pretty much only plays at 4am, or on all saturday night, probably because they figure anime fans are losers who wont be out on a saturday night. I think you're absolutely insane to claim anime is superior at pacing and dialog, especially. Japan as a whole doesn't seem to know what either of those things are. They also seem to completely fail at all humor, which they try to substitute with a series of exaggerated facial expressions on EVERYONE. It comes as no shock that every anime fan I've met has no sense of humor either. Perhaps a little is lost in translation, but I refuse to believe that Japan is laughing at hard at their shows as we are at our's.

Much like anime, cartoons strike gold in spurts. Many cartoons in the early 90's were and still are truly brilliant and enjoyable for all ages. There was a stagnant age, but Adult Swim really paved the way for this comeback that's occurred recently. Anime however has been in a rut since the late 90's. It may make a comeback someday, but not as long as the creators refuse to try anything new. Or the least they could do is remember the importance of a good soundtrack. Anime used to be so focused musically, but nowadays the title themes are noise and jibberish and it only gets worse from there. It frustrates me so much.

Japan as a whole seems to lose more territory in the entertainment market every year. At least they still make a good car, or so I'm often told.

[Doctor Fugue]

I was trying to emphasize the fact that many people are at a disadvantage because they fail to see diversity in anime; meanwhile you have exactly proved my point by being so unwilling to attempt understanding a different culture. If something doesn't fit into your world-view, you shit all over it and anyone who tries to defend it. You are admirable in your strength of belief, but you surely must understand we are all completely different and have differing definitions of good and bad, superior and inferior. No amount of hand-waving or furious typing will change that.

You say Japan doesn't comprehend pacing or dialog or humour, and yet I'm willing to wager they believe the same about whatever you like to watch.

I don't claim to completely understand Japanese nature because it is almost completely alien to western traditions, but I have spent a great deal of time surrounded by their culture and people (being a classical musician does that) and I have come to feel a good amount of affinity for their art, in all forms. It is the same with any art, yes? If it means something to you, then that is all that matters.

There is, of course, a huge amount of crap anime. Any popular format will have that problem. I never said that all anime is made of gold. I just happen to believe that there are many expertly-crafted anime both past and present that have provided new experiences for me, above and beyond anything I have seen before.