Should America or Japan feel ashame of the lack of "Jrpg"

[noiseredux]

Hmm interesting topic considering the article I plan to write this thread should give some extra food for thought.

I actually love both western and jrpgs each for their own merits. Some of my top games of all time are baldurs gate 2 and FFVI. The handhelds seem to be the proper platform for jrpgs. The more realistic the graphics attempt to be, the less is left to the imagination. The expense of making full featured titles on current gen consoles is too much a risk for jrpgs. They usually all having something that is lacking. A weak storyline, dumb characters, frame rate issues, or poor voice acting or more than 1.

Western rpgs seem to gain more from the upgrades in technology. Better graphics on characters and worlds with realistic proportions generally fair better then those who have otherwise. I think FFXIII focused so much on game engine and graphics that the rest of the game was rushed. Handhelds now basically allow for the sprite graphics and go back to the roots of jrpgs and alow them a much smaller expense and risk. Conversely, I don't see a western rpg being that good on a handheld.

I think it would be tough to discuss the current state of JRPG's without mentioning Hyperdimension, or at least the localizations of Xseed, NIS, Atlus, Compile Heart and Aksys. And of course portable gaming. Though Atlus, Aksys and NIS are bringing their games to consoles, JRPG's predominantly live on handhelds now.

[Jmustang1968]

Hmm interesting topic considering the article I plan to write this thread should give some extra food for thought.

I actually love both western and jrpgs each for their own merits. Some of my top games of all time are baldurs gate 2 and FFVI. The handhelds seem to be the proper platform for jrpgs. The more realistic the graphics attempt to be, the less is left to the imagination. The expense of making full featured titles on current gen consoles is too much a risk for jrpgs. They usually all having something that is lacking. A weak storyline, dumb characters, frame rate issues, or poor voice acting or more than 1.

Western rpgs seem to gain more from the upgrades in technology. Better graphics on characters and worlds with realistic proportions generally fair better then those who have otherwise. I think FFXIII focused so much on game engine and graphics that the rest of the game was rushed. Handhelds now basically allow for the sprite graphics and go back to the roots of jrpgs and alow them a much smaller expense and risk. Conversely, I don't see a western rpg being that good on a handheld.

I think it would be tough to discuss the current state of JRPG's without mentioning Hyperdimension, or at least the localizations of Xseed, NIS, Atlus, Compile Heart and Aksys. And of course portable gaming. Though Atlus, Aksys and NIS are bringing their games to consoles, JRPG's predominantly live on handhelds now.

Ya for sure, but Hyperdimension falls into 'it is good or has redeeming qualities but has some glaring flaws.' Basically for the niche gamer or hardcore JRPG fan, we can overlook the flaws and enjoy it, but for the mainstream it is a bad game.

I also wouldn't call any of those games graphical powerhouses, most of them look like could be PS2 games.

[Xeogred]

I guess I see grinding as different from the rest of you. To me, grinding is what you did back in the days of DQ1 of walking back and forth in order to level up so you don't get slaughtered. And WRPGs of the time were just as grind heavy. I haven't had to grind in a JRPG in years. The difference between JRPGs and WRPGs in that regard seems to me to be that JRPGs tend to have longer dungeons with a more encounters so it still feels grindy to people. But the only time I grind these days is to reach game breaking levels so I can laugh at the final bosses, not so I can proceed in the storyline.

Preach it. That or "JRPG's are nothing but cutscenes" seem to be among the lamest and most overused arguments against JRPG's I constantly see.

And it's interesting to note DQ and FF were in a way born from Wizardry.

[noiseredux]

Ya for sure, but Hyperdimension falls into 'it is good or has redeeming qualities but has some glaring flaws.' Basically for the niche gamer or hardcore JRPG fan, we can overlook the flaws and enjoy it, but for the mainstream it is a bad game.

I also wouldn't call any of those games graphical powerhouses, most of them look like could be PS2 games.

PS2? Most of them look like they could have been on PSP! But yeah, I get what yr saying about Hyperdimension. Though I think that's part of the case really -- a lot of console JRPG's now pretty much know they're only for a very niche market, so they're really not attempting to cater to anybody else.

[J T]

All I know is that if Ni No Kuni doesn't see an English translation, then everyone should be ashamed.

Look at how beautiful this game is!

[Inazuma]

Did the Ni no Kuni movie ever come out in America? If so, then I would say there is a decent chance of a domestic PS3 release.

Did the DS version come out here? I actually bought the Japanese version but I haven't even opened it. >_>

[ZenErik]

Did the Ni no Kuni movie ever come out in America? If so, then I would say there is a decent chance of a domestic PS3 release.

Did the DS version come out here? I actually bought the Japanese version but I haven't even opened it. >_>

I don't think there is a Ni no Kuni movie.

[Ack]

I guess I see grinding as different from the rest of you. To me, grinding is what you did back in the days of DQ1 of walking back and forth in order to level up so you don't get slaughtered. And WRPGs of the time were just as grind heavy. I haven't had to grind in a JRPG in years. The difference between JRPGs and WRPGs in that regard seems to me to be that JRPGs tend to have longer dungeons with a more encounters so it still feels grindy to people. But the only time I grind these days is to reach game breaking levels so I can laugh at the final bosses, not so I can proceed in the storyline.

Actually I think this is a fair point to make. A lot of you guys springboarded off of what I said, but in truth some of what folks complain about in JRPGs did also happen in WRPGs, such as grinding. There are folks who grind in WRPGs. I know, I just played through one, and there were a couple of points where I grinded before a big battle I knew was coming up, just so I could eek my characters up a single level.

Also, as far as combat is concerned, WRPGs have had moments of being worse. Amongst WRPG fans, Baldur's Gate is held in high esteem, but melee combat largely consisted of point, click, and wait at the time. Spells added a little more, but not really. However, having played more recent WRPGs in the same vein, I've watched the combat systems get more fleshed out and better handled.

I've also seen combat handled in ways I generally don't hold highly, such as the Elder Scrolls games. Sure, I often play combat heavy characters, but even though I love those games for their freedom, I have never really felt like the combat quite matched up. But I have seen attempts at innovation, such as adding in chargeable attacks or mixing magic and melee possibilities in the upcoming title.

And that's a big part of what I believe folks are getting at: innovation has been poorly lacking in general in JRPGs. I can sit down with a WRPG and understand that it's from a different generation because of changes in the combat system. For a JRPG, only the graphical upgrade tells me it's a more modern game. Yes, there are JRPGs with interesting and innovative combat systems...at least I think so. The Tales and Star Ocean series, Xenogears, Legend of Dragoon, Legend of Legaia... these have tried different styles of combat, some of which worked quite well. Even the FF series has seen some tweaks to how its rounds are handled, though arguably not that much. And of the titles I mentioned, they all debuted during the SNES and PS1 days.

I think my biggest complaint though with JRPGs in terms of lack of innovation is the story. Nowadays I see the same thing over and over again: a group of teens with issues take on a god or a world-destroying entity and solve their emo problems along the way while asserting how great love and friendship are. I'm tired of this.

[BoringSupreez]

I think my biggest complaint though with JRPGs in terms of lack of innovation is the story. Nowadays I see the same thing over and over again: a group of teens with issues take on a god or a world-destroying entity and solve their emo problems along the way while asserting how great love and friendship are. I'm tired of this.

Japanese game devs are quite capable of making new, original stories. Just look at the MGS series. It's just that for some reason they feel compelled to do the same sort of story over and over for their RPGs, and to be honest, the teens-save-the-world-and-solve-their-emo-problems story type wasn't that great in the first place.

[Gnashvar]

All I know is that if Ni No Kuni doesn't see an English translation, then everyone should be ashamed.

Look at how beautiful this game is!

That is a very nice looking game.