classic gaming via modern technology: your opinion?

[AppleQueso]

I think a lot of these consoles have lasted far longer than anyone could've ever really expected them to.

I mean most Sega CDs work still for example.

[dsheinem]

I think a lot of these consoles have lasted far longer than anyone could've ever really expected them to.

I mean most Sega CDs work still for example.

I certainly get that consoles with moving parts can have wear and tear over the years, but replacing belts or springs is really not too difficult. I don't see why a well treated consoles has to ever necessarily wear out to a point where it is beyond repair. Even current consoles with too much heat + shit solder can be reballed. There's no reason they can't be fixed in the future, too...

[pepharytheworm]

You know what the main reason for me to collect over emulate is? To have a limit.
Like you said I can have access to everything, so how do I pick anything? You can say just play the ones I really like, but I always hear about new games everyday and then I want to try them out.

Just for an experiment you should give a kid a PSP with every genesis game made including imports. Then give another kid a genesis with 20 select titles. Then see which one played through the most games, after a month.

I have a feeling the kid with the 20 games will play through more, and in the end get more out of the gaming experience.

By the way I have to add since Ivo mentioned books. I can't stand kindle and don't see the point for novels. Why the heck would I need my entire book collection on me at any one time? If I was going on a long trip would carrying three books really take up that much room? Mp3 players I can understand, but digital books I don't.

[AppleQueso]

Like you said I can have access to everything, so how do I pick anything?

People with larger collections say the exact same thing.

[dogman91]

Emulation is simply not the same... the controls feel a lot different, usually there's some issues with the input being precise, game speed at least *seems* different, and especially with something like N64 or SNES a lot of emulators use game-specific hacks to make them work rather than actually emulating the system itself (for the most part).

An example is the Sonic series on the Wii virtual console and with Sonic Mega Collection; for some reason the controls were just not that fluid at all; pretty stiff actually where I noticed it wasn't as fun as before (not the speed momentum or jumping mechanics with Sonic as I remembered). I even noticed some sounds were messed up like the sound effect for the breaking-apart ledges. Bought a Sega CDX later with Sonic and what do you know; the sounds are fine and everything feels great. BTW, I also heard because since Song Mega/Gems Collection simply uses the GENS emulator, there's some technical issues in games like Sonic CD with the water or something if I recall correctly.

Even some games I played in bsnes or Regen, while definitely an improvement, simply doesn't match the original hardware when going between those and the actual console for comparisons.

Super Mario Bros. is a good example to tell the difference as the jumping is a bit different between an actual NES and an emulator.

Analog controls also almost always suck if it's not on the original hardware (looking at you N64).

Obviously some people are not going to be able to tell a difference, and I see nothing wrong with using emulators, but the slight imperfections bug me enough to buy the original hardware to play the games as the developers tested them on... it's the hardware they tweaked the game for and a buggy emulator optimized for another console slapped into a compilation doesn't "cut it" for me.

[BurningDoom]

In the case of the NES, it's a huge improvement. No more screwing with cartridges and wiggle & blow tricks. Other than that, though, I'd rather play on the original hardware with the original controllers. Heck, I still play my NES games on my NES too, what am I talking about? There's just more of a novelty factor when playing on the original systems.

Nothing wrong with the modern route, though, if that's your only access to the older games. Better that, than nothing.

[Opa Opa]

Emulation is great when you're at college and don't have to lug around systems and worry about things getting lost/stolen.

It's also great for trying out games before you buy them; especially expensive games (Radiant Silvergun, anyone?).

Although I do prefer original hardware, there are a lot of times when you just can't deal with it/afford it.

[DinnerX]

Emulation is simply not the same... the controls feel a lot different, usually there's some issues with the input being precise, game speed at least *seems* different, and especially with something like N64 or SNES a lot of emulators use game-specific hacks to make them work rather than actually emulating the system itself (for the most part).

An example is the Sonic series on the Wii virtual console and with Sonic Mega Collection; for some reason the controls were just not that fluid at all; pretty stiff actually where I noticed it wasn't as fun as before (not the speed momentum or jumping mechanics with Sonic as I remembered). I even noticed some sounds were messed up like the sound effect for the breaking-apart ledges. Bought a Sega CDX later with Sonic and what do you know; the sounds are fine and everything feels great. BTW, I also heard because since Song Mega/Gems Collection simply uses the GENS emulator, there's some technical issues in games like Sonic CD with the water or something if I recall correctly.

Even some games I played in bsnes or Regen, while definitely an improvement, simply doesn't match the original hardware when going between those and the actual console for comparisons.

Super Mario Bros. is a good example to tell the difference as the jumping is a bit different between an actual NES and an emulator.

Analog controls also almost always suck if it's not on the original hardware (looking at you N64).

Obviously some people are not going to be able to tell a difference, and I see nothing wrong with using emulators, but the slight imperfections bug me enough to buy the original hardware to play the games as the developers tested them on... it's the hardware they tweaked the game for and a buggy emulator optimized for another console slapped into a compilation doesn't "cut it" for me.

Controls feel different because of the slight lag emulation inherently causes and because you switch from using a dpad to an analog stick or keyboard or from one analog stick to another.

16-bit systems (SNES included) and earlier can be quite accurately emulated (although there are few problems) in a very low level fashion. When you get newer systems, like the N64, the emulators are using high level emulation, which is less accurate and more hacky in nature. With high level emulation it's more like emulating DirectX instead of emulating the particulars of a graphics card. Games can definitely run at noticeably faster or slower than on the original hardware then and have other issues.

Sonic CD on gems was ported and sega messed up the port. That's why the waters weird there. Lazy sega.

I like to mess around with emulation. Especially emulating one console on another. I do prefer the original hardware though.

[Ivo]

I certainly get that consoles with moving parts can have wear and tear over the years, but replacing belts or springs is really not too difficult. I don't see why a well treated consoles has to ever necessarily wear out to a point where it is beyond repair. Even current consoles with too much heat + shit solder can be reballed. There's no reason they can't be fixed in the future, too...

It is not difficult while you have "compatible parts", and even then you are already taking this well beyond what most people are willing to do to play video games.

There is certainly a reason why they can't be fixed in the future - replacement parts are going to become scarce and possibly some knowledge of the archaic electronics may be a lot less commonplace. For example, for how long will you continue to have suitable 72-pin connectors for the NES and then for the other cartridge based consoles (I know they last a long time, but they don't last forever). What about appropriate optical lenses for the CD based Hardware? What about the Dreamcast and other proprietary optical formats?

Obsolescence is just a very real issue. If you think 40 years is still ok, fair enough. What about 100? 200? Racketboy posted a video of that very interesting panel discussing some of these issues.

Ivo.

[dsheinem]

I certainly get that consoles with moving parts can have wear and tear over the years, but replacing belts or springs is really not too difficult. I don't see why a well treated consoles has to ever necessarily wear out to a point where it is beyond repair. Even current consoles with too much heat + shit solder can be reballed. There's no reason they can't be fixed in the future, too...

It is not difficult while you have "compatible parts", and even then you are already taking this well beyond what most people are willing to do to play video games.

There is certainly a reason why they can't be fixed in the future - replacement parts are going to become scarce and possibly some knowledge of the archaic electronics may be a lot less commonplace. For example, for how long will you continue to have suitable 72-pin connectors for the NES and then for the other cartridge based consoles (I know they last a long time, but they don't last forever). What about appropriate optical lenses for the CD based Hardware? What about the Dreamcast and other proprietary optical formats?

Obsolescence is just a very real issue. If you think 40 years is still ok, fair enough. What about 100? 200? Racketboy posted a video of that very interesting panel discussing some of these issues.

Ivo.

I was at the panel and certainly understand the LONG term problems...but 100 or 200 years is very different than 30-40 years...

I don't expect to have to rely on emulation for most classic systems in MY lifetime. At some point, though, it will be the most viable option for the vast majority of retro-gamers.