Saturn the worst console ever? You have got to be kidding

[jfrost]

Honestly, I wouldn't have liked a Saturn back in the day. It's great to have one nowadays, but back then I was playing hundreds of games on my Playstation. My cousin had a Saturn and while I was awed by X-men vs. Street Fighter, I quickly could find something else to have fun with. Saturn owners weren't so lucky.

[MrPopo]

The N64 on the other hand had two major problems, the fact that it stuck with the Cartridge format rather than moving to CD (which led to them losing the Final Fantasy franchise). .

But you're forgetting that the cart format meant that the N64 was the only console of the generation to not suffer from gratuitous unskippable CGI.

[Mendoza]

Honestly, I wouldn't have liked a Saturn back in the day. It's great to have one nowadays, but back then I was playing hundreds of games on my Playstation. My cousin had a Saturn and while I was awed by X-men vs. Street Fighter, I quickly could find something else to have fun with. Saturn owners weren't so lucky.

Luckier than Jag, 3DO, or CDI owners.

[Original_Name]

The way I see it, he could just as easily be calling the Neo Geo AES the worst console ever. Yes, it was a very difficult sell to make and ultimately ended up costing SNK their business, but still, when you're playing Metal Slug 3, Fatal Fury: Mark of the Wolves, and Blazing Star, it's hard to call it the worst console ever, just as it's difficult to do the same to the Saturn when playing NiGHTS into Dreams, Panzer Dragoon Saga, and Radiant Silvergun. They're tremendously good consoles, both very much worth earning and only marred by the poor executive decisions which made them unpopular in their time and difficult to collect for in the present. In my honest opinion, as far as quality of library goes, the Saturn is dead-even with the Nintendo 64 -- and I'm being as objective as possible in saying that.

[the7k]

Indeed, the Sega Saturn is the worst console ever. That's why I have it hooked up to my TV with the very limited space I have and play it almost every day.

Not your cup of tea? Okay, I can buy that. Worst console ever? Someone has their head on backwards.

[Mendoza]

Damn this guy let him have it but good. A bit of retro snobbery in his post, but still a clear and systematic dismantling of this guys blog post.
by pzykotikjp January 30, 2008 6:24 PM PST
First off, why don't you do some research? It would certainly make you seem at least A LITTLE BIT less incompetent than you apparently are.

See, the Saturn did well in Japan. Even beating out the N64. In fact, if it wasn't for the failures of Sega of America as well as Squaresoft's Playstation support, chances are the Saturn would have continued to go toe-to-toe with the Playstation in Japan for the duration of its existence.

Granted, thats just talking about numbers, which certainly does not give any indication of how good a console is or isn't. Of course, your article only covers numbers for the US, an area in which games like GTA and the annual iterations of Madden sell millions plus upon release, so you're entire point is rather incompetent in that area as well.

So is the Saturn the worst console ever? No. And only someone who knows absolutely nothing about videogames would ever make that statement to begin with. In the US, one of the most critically acclaimed RPGs to ever be released came out exclusively for the Saturn (Panzer Dragoon Saga). Likewise, Treasure put out Guardian Heroes exclusively on the Saturn, which is one of the best side-scrolling beat 'em up titles in existence. Of course, as you mentioned, Sega did also put out a plethora of great arcade titles as well as original games (Astal, NiGHTS, Burning Rangers, etc.).

And thats just in the US. In Japan, the Saturn was KING of 2D fighters and 2D shooters. In fact, the most praised and sought after 2D shooter of all time, Radiant Silvergun, came out exclusively on the Sega Saturn and can still only be found on the Saturn. This is not to mention legendary shooters such as Batsugun and Battle Garegga, both of which are also exclusive, and both of which are also highly praised amongst fans of the genre.

And in the 2D fighting realm, the Saturn was uncontested. The use of the memory expansion carts made it so that it could actually play ARCADE PERFECT ports of the latest releases from Capcom, SNK, Sunsoft, etc. And the Saturn is still the only home for amazing fighters like X-Men vs. Street Fighter, Marvel vs. Street Fighter, and Astra Superstars. It also has arguably the best version of Street Fighter Zero 3 (aka Street Fighter Alpha 3 in the states).

So if you're a fan of classic gaming, then no, you're article is horribly wrong. The Saturn is the 2D king of consoles, and the only thing that even compares is SNK's expensive and niche Neo-Geo AES.

Now, thats just looking at the software. The hardware itself was excellent. There's a reason CAPCOM brought the Saturn controller out for the PC and the PS2. And with the expansion bay up top, you could use extra RAM for some games, you could use it for your saves (which stored far more than any PS1 memory card), you could use it to surf the internet, you could play Saturn games ONLINE, eventually Hitachi made a VCD chip for it so the Saturn could play VCDs, and they even made a special Hitachi Navi GPS HiSaturn which is a Sega Saturn with a built in GPS system, a TFT-backlit matrix screen (same as the PSP uses), and even has inputs for microphones for karaoke.

So on the hardware, people did A LOT with the Saturn. Which honestly, puts it ahead of most anything else that was out at the time. The Saturn hardware was incredibly versatile. The only problem was that the Saturn's architecture was painfully difficult to write code for, so lesser talented teams had a hard time really making it shine. But if you look at near anything Sega made, look at Team Ninja's "Dead or Alive", look at Atlus' "Princess Crown", Time Warner Interactive's "Shinrei Jusatsushi Taromaru", virtually anything by Capcom, or anything by Treasure, you'll see talented teams really pushing the limits of the Saturn and showing off some impressive stuff. There is no PS1 game that is even in the same league as Princess Crown or Astal.

So the software was good, the hardware was good, and the technical capabilities of the machine were good for anyone who knew how to use it. So, how is this bad again? Well, I'll tell you how you came to that conclusion:

You're incompetent. You have absolutely no idea about what you're talking, and feel you must spew this drivel because you probably think it makes you look cool or something. But no, because first off, your article is full of falacies. The last Sega released Saturn game in the US was Panzer Dragoon Saga in April of '98. The last US released Saturn game wasn't from Sega, it was Magic Knight Rayearth from Working Designs in November of '98. Now, Europe's last Saturn was from Sega, and it came out in Dec. '98 (Deep Fear). Likewise, the last mainstream release for the Saturn in Japan wasn't from Sega, it was from Capcom, and it came out in 2000 (Final Fight Revenge).

At any rate, in the end you challenge us to name 30 great games from the Saturn. I'll do you one better and name 70:
01. Astal (US)
02. Fighter's Megamix (US)
03. Keio Flying Squadron 2 (JP or EU)
04. Radiant Silvergun (JP)
05. Guardian Heroes (JP)
06. Silhouette Mirage (JP)
07. Panzer Dragoon (US)
08. Panzer Dragoon II Zwei (US)
09. Panzer Dragoon Saga (US)
10. NiGHTS (US)
11. Burning Rangers (US)
12. Virtua Fighter (US)
13. Virtua Fighter 2 (US)
14. Virtua Cop (US)
15. Virtua Cop 2 (US)
16. Daytona USA (US)
17. Virtual On (US)
18. Saturn Bomberman (US)
19. Soukyuugurentai (JP)
20. Hyper Duel (JP)
21. Game Tengoku (JP
22. Cleopatra Fortune (JP)
23. Street Fighter Alpha (US)
24. Street Fighter Alpha 2 (US)
25. Street Fighter Zero 3 (JP)
26. X-Men vs. Street Fighter (JP)
27. Marvel Super Heroes vs. Street Fighter (JP)
28. Astra Superstars (JP)
29. Metal Slug (JP)
30. King of Fighters '95 (JP or EU)
31. King of Fighters '96 (JP)
32. King of Fighters '97 (JP)
33. Real Bout Fatal Fury (JP)
34. Real Bout Fatal Fury Special (JP)
35. Samsho III (JP)
36. Samsho IV (JP)
37. Albert Odyssey (US)
38. Magic Knight Rayearth (US)
39. Shining the Holy Ark (US)
40. Iron Storm (US)
41. Dragon Force (US)
42. Dragon Force 2 (JP)
43. Princess Crown (JP)
44. Battle Garegga (JP)
45. Dead or Alive (JP)
46. Assault Suit Leynos 2 (JP)
47. Batsugun (JP)
48. Galactic Attack (US)
49. Darius Gaiden (US)
50. Bulk Slash (JP)
51. Blast Wind (JP)
52. Thunder Force V (JP)
53. Vampire Hunter (JP)
54. Vampire Savior (JP)
55. Shining Force III (US)
56. Puyo Puyo Sun (JP)
57. Bubble Symphony (JP)
58. Three Dirty Dwarves (US)
59. Legend of Oasis (US)
60. Dark Savior (US)
61. Powerslave (US)
62. Deep Fear (JP or EU)
63. Necronomicon Digital Pinball (JP) Arguably the best digital pinball game in existence.
64. Fighting Vipers (US)
65. Dungeons and Dragons Collection (JP)
66. Die Hard Arcade (US)
67. Prikura Daisakusen (JP)
68. House of the Dead (US)
69. Mega Man 8 (US) Which is still the best version of it.
70. Magical Drop III (JP)

And I would like the point out that I only listed games accessible to people that can only speak or read English. Meaning, the list I constructed completely IGNORES the Saturn's dominance with the Langrisser series, the three expansions on Shining Force III, Wachenroeder, the highly estemmed Sakura Taisen series, etc.

Also, I made it a point to, for the most part, avoid collections since technically that wouldn't count (i.e. Konami's various collections, Sega Ages, the Thunder Force Gold Packs, etc.). My exception was the Dungeons and Dragons Collection from Capcom, but I only used that because those are not available anywhere else and are two of the best side scrolling beat 'em ups ever made.

But, fact remains, for the hardcore gamer, the Saturn is right up there with the PC-Engine Duo as probably THE greatest console to exist. For people like you, who no doubt gorge yourselves on the latest sports title from EA, licensed game, Rockstar game, etc., then you, I wouldn't expect someone with that level of ignorance to understand what makes the Saturn great. But for those of us who actually play good games, the Saturn is about as good as you can get.

So please Mr. Reisinger, do the world a favor and quit writing articles until:
A. You learn to research your subjects.
or
B. You become a competent individual.

Because as is, right now you are nothing more than an embarrassment to CNet and journalists everywhere.

[Original_Name]

^ BEAST MODE.

[final fight cd]

Panzer Dragoon Saga and Radiant Silvergun are two of the best games ever made in their respective genres.

not only is the saturn a over hyped machine, but so is panzer dragoon saga. i get the impression that people form preconceived notions about how great the game is solely because it is rare/sought after and damn expensive. it is like the cd-i zelda games. a minor internet celebrity bashes the games and soon everybody and their mom says the games are terrible even though probably 50% of them have never played one.

hypothetically speaking, if the panzer dragoon saga was ported to the 64 and ps1 i guarantee it wouldn't get the praise that it does. and therefore, the saturn wouldn't get the praise that it does.

[Ack]

Damn Mendoza, all that and he left off Cyberbots.

But my next question is "Why are you all freaking out over an article posted in 2008?"

[dlmvii]

Panzer Dragoon Saga and Radiant Silvergun are two of the best games ever made in their respective genres.

not only is the saturn a over hyped machine, but so is panzer dragoon saga. i get the impression that people form preconceived notions about how great the game is solely because it is rare/sought after and damn expensive. it is like the cd-i zelda games. a minor internet celebrity bashes the games and soon everybody and their mom says the games are terrible even though probably 50% of them have never played one.

hypothetically speaking, if the panzer dragoon saga was ported to the 64 and ps1 i guarantee it wouldn't get the praise that it does. and therefore, the saturn wouldn't get the praise that it does.

This is most likely true. A game like Astal, as well, would have likely been lost in the sea of ps1 platformers. But since it didn't have much competition on the saturn, it stood out.

Also, post #1000! took long enough