Dreamcast burner question

[Ziggy]

Probably so you can download them faster. ISO/mp3 is the shittiest way you can get any game, and it's poor quality. BIN/CUE is alright, but for what ever reason the Clone CD format is suppose to be the best for PS1 games (just like for whatever reason they chose CDI for DC games).

I get my CCD PS1 images from UG, I believe I've downloaded them from Snesorama before too.

[executioner]

PS1 is usually CCD format. As for Dreamcast, Gamecube and Saturn, I just use IMG Burn for all of them. For DC I mount the CDI and rip it to BIN/CUE and then burn it, for Gamecube I rename the extension to .iso and burn it, and for Saturn I just burn the (hopefully) BIN/CUE or fix and up and burn the ISO/mp3/CUE.

Just the confirmation I needed to finally uninstall discjuggler and use only IMGburn for everything I need. I've read that virtual clone drive, which is also free, is slightly better than daemon tools.

[Ziggy]

Well aparently, you could possibly break a CDI image if you rip it to BIN/CUE and not have it self boot. I've burnt about half a dozen self boot CDI's using Boot Dreams and about half a dozen self boot CDI's ripping them to BIN/CUE first, they all self boot and I haven't noticed a difference.

And you can't use IMG burn for everything. You need Clone CD to burn CCD images. I never tried ripping a CCD image to BIN/CUE in order to burn it with IMG burn before, I don't know what results that might have. I suspect nothing, but it will apparently screw up the copy protection in the game (if it has it, I'm assuming).

Taken from a post at UG on why ISO sucks major for CD based games, and some other info on image types...

Yeah, if I had to choose one, and only one format, it would be Clonecd. It covers all: games with audio tracks, copy protections and multi-sessions.

iso is ONLY advisable for DVD.


why .iso is crap and is only used by newbies who don't know its limitations and proper CD-ripping 101:

- it doesn't cover audio tracks.
ALL Sega Saturn, ALL PC-Engine CD, ALL PC-FX, heaps of PSX and old PC games use audio tracks. Ripping them as .iso will end up with tiny single data tracked images that have no music. In fact, for NEC systems (PCE, PC-FX) you'd end up with a useless coaster since the first track for those systems is always an audio track THEN followed by the data and several other audio/data tracks. Ripping that to .iso will only result in a single audio track (the generic voiced message telling you not to insert the disc in a CD player).

- it doesn't support multi-session
This is important for Dreamcast games. No multi-session = no selfbootable games. Basically re-ripping a selfboot DC game as an .iso will get you being chased by angry pitchfork&torch-wielding villagers. Heck, not even non-boot DC games were dumped as .iso
.iso isn't to be used at all on DC games (or at all).

- CD protection.
For those who want 1:1 copies of protected games, ripping them as .iso will break the protection (in a bad way) making the game unplayable and needing to look for a crack patch which is what some people wanted to avoid doing in the first place. CloneCD (ccd/sub/img) and Alcohol120% (mdf/mds) are to be used here.

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From personal experience, I find .iso an unstable format that breaks or gets corrupt easily. There is no checksum or any type of file consistency security or extra information accompanying it.


There is a program out there that can rip CDs as iso/cue. But that's basically a bin/cue, just the .bin happens to have a different file extension, an .iso. I don't like this iso/cue combination cause it's not dummy-proof. I can see many beginners ignoring the cue and going right for their preffered .iso and burning that instead (resulting in a bad burn that has no music or will not run at all).

I know from experience all the ups & downs of the formats to know for myself what CD image to rip to. I use CDRwin (bin/cue) for basically everything cause it's a well-established old format that's been around for years and supports audio tracks, which all old games for several systems have. Many ripping/burning programs support bin/cue. For CD-protected games allowed here on UG, I use CloneCD (sub/ccd/img). The protections on these games are all old and can be burned on CloneCD.

Alcohol120% (.mds/mdf) is better suited for modern PC games with tough CD protections which CloneCD can't handle. (Modern new games you obviously won't find here at UG). It's an ok program but it has one fatal flaw few are aware of:

Do not rip mixed mode games into bin/cue with alcohol120%.

It removes the 2-second gap between the audio tracks, resulting in music not looping correctly and other offsynch troubles. It's not a correct raw 1:1 copy then.

Discjuggler (.cdi) is mostly used only for CD-ripped Dreamcast games. It's preffered to not re-rip scene releases cause they tend to break or get altered. Personally I just unrar the multi-rars and re-rar the CD image back in a single rar, keeping the image exactly the same. (I find multi-rars kinda cluttering). Then I back up the rars on DVD or other hard drives. If a DC game was released as alcohol120% or CloneCD format, you might as well keep them in those formats as well. Bin/cue DC discs are non-bootable. Again, might as well keep them like that, unless you want to experiment to make them selfboot yourself (results are not always succesful and if they are, they might not fit on a 80min CDR).

Poweriso (.daa) is too little, too late. Before it came along, we already had alot disc formats to choose from. Adding another one is just redundant. And it's exclusive to only Poweriso, since other ripping/burning programs do not support it.

Nero (.nrg). This image format didn't really gain popularity like the others. I certainly haven't seen much of this image being used for 10 years. It's always outnumbered by .bin and .img and even .iso.

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.iso is to be used only if you know all the facts I stated above to avoid making bad rips. Yes, it's alot to read but if you plan on sharing games correctly you have to know these things, either now or by error when people come back at you complaining that you uploaded a bad rip and wasted their ratio/bandwith. (worse, when they find out months/years later when they're about to play the game to realize they got a bad rip, I wouldn't want to be around them to see the mad look in their eyes!).
So you must know beforehand that you are ripping a game that has no CD protection and no audio tracks or multi-session. Then .iso is ok. (though I still don't recommend it, cause like I said it gets corrupt/breaks the easiest).

I am not familiar with Linux OS or Mac. Somebody else has to fill the gaps for me about what formats are supported on them. Maybe there are tricks or programs that can make them mount / burn them.

So when you see ISO/mp3/and hopefully a CUE (because a lot of times they forget to include the CUE) try to look for another format. I just assume people rip to ISO/mp3 because it's a smaller amount to download. So then you have to go through the hassle of converting the mp3's to wav and updating the CUE, or making a CUE if it wasn't included. It's a pretty big hassle, not to mention the audio has been compressed to mp3 so I guess it loses a little bit of quality there.

[Niode]

ISO/MP3 is just about the worst format for games. The amount of times I've tried to download Saturn games, unrar and they're in this god-awful format. I just delete it and look for another. It's a complete joke of a format, and to expect me to transcode a compressed audio into a .wav file is beyond contemptible. The people who rip in this format need a big 'ol slap, right across the face because they are gibbering idiots.

[IcKy99]

i usually burn cdi images with bootdreams @ 4x and they always work