The truth about literature

[Original_Name]

I didn't think we were disagreeing on much through out the conversation at all.

It thought this was just an open discussion kind of thing.

Well yeah, there was definitely never even a hint of hostility, but I thought you were saying that there was no concrete model to attach the word art to, a notion I can respect, but find difficult to accept as a final conclusion. Later you said, "art is a noun for something constructed by man to mean something. May that something be solid like a painting or sculpture, or an action like a dance or song." which specifies that it is constructed by man to mean something. I guess what I'm trying to say is that while the possibilities of art's reception is endless, there must be specific, unobjectionable aspects which make it its own unique concept in the first place, whether we call it "art" or anything else.

Anyway, yeah, lordofduct, you get the highest of fives transmittable through text. This is far above and beyond what is expected from retro gaming forums.

[General Chaos]

Anyway, yeah, lordofduct, you get the highest of fives transmittable through text. This is far above and beyond what is expected from retro gaming forums.

Oh but this isn't just any retro gaming forum, it's Racketboy. In all seriousness, you are both gentlemen and philosophers. It's a pleasure to have a forum community like this to post or just lurk around in.

[Original_Name]

Anyway, yeah, lordofduct, you get the highest of fives transmittable through text. This is far above and beyond what is expected from retro gaming forums.

Oh but this isn't just any retro gaming forum, it's Racketboy. In all seriousness, you are both gentlemen and philosophers. It's a pleasure to have a forum community like this to post or just lurk around in.

Yo, Chaos. *highest of fives transmittable through text*

[RCBH928]

General chaos

Discussion to me is: Everyone giving his input in a subject, and trying to come out with the correct answer

Arguing : a debate, each side of the argument wants to prove himself correct by presenting facts.

You can differentiate one of the other like this:
1)Discussions are enjoyed by all those who are involved and the atmosphere is calm
2)Arguments makes everyone upset, even those who are not involved, and usually the atmosphere is intense.

I am not sure what was going between you guys, but it is nice to see how informed are the members of this forum.

[Limewater]

Well, the conversation lordofduct and I had makes this very difficult to phrase, but the very "canvas" you're talking about is the concrete piece, and the improvisation, no matter how much there is within, HAS been planned to occur atop that concrete piece. The "canvas" is the discernable song with the concept of "random" improvisation already determined to exist on top of that "canvas". It would have been alot easier to explain back when I felt that I had a concrete word for the concept I was describing.

But, getting back to the stripper, you said that her dancing is not art because it is not planned. Yet, a striptease does have a basic structure. A girl comes out, dances around, during the dance clothing is removed, and, by the end, the dancer is wearing significantly less clothing than she had originally.

I don't see the distinction here.

[Luke]

But, getting back to the stripper, you said that her dancing is not art because it is not planned. Yet, a striptease does have a basic structure. A girl comes out, dances around, during the dance clothing is removed, and, by the end, the dancer is wearing significantly less clothing than she had originally.

I don't see the distinction here.

I went to a few strip clubs at my bachelor party, and almost every dance I got, no matter which stripper or strip club, was the same. Except for one where I was taken into a back room behind the kitchen, but I won't get into that.

[General Chaos]

General chaos

Discussion to me is: Everyone giving his input in a subject, and trying to come out with the correct answer

Arguing : a debate, each side of the argument wants to prove himself correct by presenting facts.

You can differentiate one of the other like this:
1)Discussions are enjoyed by all those who are involved and the atmosphere is calm
2)Arguments makes everyone upset, even those who are not involved, and usually the atmosphere is intense.

I am not sure what was going between you guys, but it is nice to see how informed are the members of this forum.

King, I certainly hope I did not come across as condescending or argumentative. I just wanted to emphasize that, at least in my eyes were are not engaging in an argument or debate. My thanks to you for providing an interesting and obviously provocative question.

[General Chaos]

Except for one where I was taken into a back room behind the kitchen, but I won't get into that.

Now that sounds sanitary. Is it b/c they don't have cameras back there?

[Original_Name]

Well, the conversation lordofduct and I had makes this very difficult to phrase, but the very "canvas" you're talking about is the concrete piece, and the improvisation, no matter how much there is within, HAS been planned to occur atop that concrete piece. The "canvas" is the discernable song with the concept of "random" improvisation already determined to exist on top of that "canvas". It would have been alot easier to explain back when I felt that I had a concrete word for the concept I was describing.

But, getting back to the stripper, you said that her dancing is not art because it is not planned. Yet, a striptease does have a basic structure. A girl comes out, dances around, during the dance clothing is removed, and, by the end, the dancer is wearing significantly less clothing than she had originally.

I don't see the distinction here.

Actually yeah, you're correct there. As long as the spontaneous act had the intention of being a "dance" of some sort all along, the execution and improvisation therein does not make it any more or less art. I think... I hate to look like a bumbling idiot after lordofduct derailed my use of art as a distinct concept, but it seems like the line between communication and art is being blurred too much... by the definition we've been moving to... an expression may be considered art from the moment that the particular instance of communication is considered beautiful. Actually... I quite like that definition. Wow, I REALLY like that definition. Thoughts?

[Original_Name]

General chaos

Discussion to me is: Everyone giving his input in a subject, and trying to come out with the correct answer

Arguing : a debate, each side of the argument wants to prove himself correct by presenting facts.

You can differentiate one of the other like this:
1)Discussions are enjoyed by all those who are involved and the atmosphere is calm
2)Arguments makes everyone upset, even those who are not involved, and usually the atmosphere is intense.

I am not sure what was going between you guys, but it is nice to see how informed are the members of this forum.

King, I certainly hope I did not come across as condescending or argumentative. I just wanted to emphasize that, at least in my eyes were are not engaging in an argument or debate. My thanks to you for providing an interesting and obviously provocative question.

By the definition you gave, we were most certainly engaging in discussion; at one point I used the term "disagreement" which I suppose was an incorrect term... our points themselves were in disagreement with one another, but our intentions were to understand one another. His views (and Limewater's inquiries) altered mine, enabling me to use what I already knew and what he taught me in order to come to my new (and in all likelihood temporary) conclusion of when an expression may be considered art, as can be read in my last comment.

An expression may be considered art from the moment that the particular instance of communication is considered beautiful.