Paranormal Message Board

[GSZX1337]

Not to add fuel to the fire, but tonight is Ghosthunters night on Sci-fi (Syfy)

Aww, I just bought the Ghostbusters 1&2 box set.

[RCBH928]

@zarathstra and Inazuma

I am not sure what are you arguing for. From your response I figured this out:
You think I said "If I say something does exists then it does"
because both of you told me we won't believe in elves and in purple monsters because you said so.

I never said that, I said that people who can't proof that something does NOT exist laugh at people who can't proof that it exists.
Here is an example:

There is a wall, behind the wall there is a treasure. But its in between four walls.
3 people are there.
#1 says: There is a treasure behind that wall
#2 says: You must be stupid, why so? Cause your parents told you so? THERE IS NO TREASURE! DO YOU SEE IT! UNLESS YOU SHOW ME YOU ARE DUMB BECAUSE SCIENCE DOES NOT PROVE IT.
#3 says: I don't know if there is a treasure out there I can't tell.

I forgive the 3rd. He simple doesn't know, he doesn't make fun of any one. He is not an extremist. He simply says I can't believe something unless I see proof. Very understandable.

The other two got beliefs. One thinks it exists, the other thinks he is stupid to think it exists without proof and laugh at him. Why would he laugh at him? They are basically equal in argument. No one can prove if the treasure exists or not, so no one makes fun of the other.

The other thing is you argue that the bible is wrong and is contradicting. I never said God exists and the bible was his teachings. You assumed that. Maybe God exists but the Bible is not his teachings, , maybe it was man made. Maybe the Jews are right, or the Muslims are right, or some one else . Why do you tie God to the Bible only?

@Zarathstra
You said that long ago people believed in more than one god. Yes, but who brought the idea of god to every culture in the world? Did they all decided "You know what? We think there is a supreme being out there and we all should worship him. He must have teachings and rules too" . I mean who ever brought the idea of a God/s and hell/ heaven must be one creative guy with wild imagination, but to happen in every civilization being so far from each other with different culture and language is something to think about. Same goes for ghosts, over history and different nations they believed in some sort of spirits/ghosts. The idea of ghosts are really wild "There are other beings around that are translucent and they appear some times and they are creepy". It is really wild and it is hard to believe that every nation thought of it by itself yet it is very similar.

Compare it to other ideas. Elves, Santa , leprechauns, fairies, vampires...how come these are not wide spread over history. But ghosts? Almost all nations believe in ghosts with exact same definition over the thousands of years. How come?
I am not trying to convince you they exist, I am just saying if some idea exists in all civilizations and nations then it is something to think about if it true or not. It is one hell of a coincidence if they come up with the same wild ideas.
When Columbus discovered America, there were native Americans. Who gave them the idea of ghosts and gods too?

I didn't see your dragon, but I can't prove it doesn't exist. Shall I laugh and say you are dumb and stupid. What if it really did exist? Its just my limit of perception. Unless I can 100% sure prove that it doesn't exist I should believe otherwise. I am sure whoever said the earth was round they laughed at him too since they saw the earth as flat with their eyes. See, do not laugh unless you can prove 100% sure the opposite.

[Inazuma]

@kingmohd84

Your analogy with the treasure that cannot be seen because it's behind a wall is a poor one. First off, its not that extraordinary of a claim compared to things like ghosts and god. If someone tells you there is treasure behind the wall, you may be doubtful but at least you know it's possible. If he was telling you it was the tooth fairy, you would have a hard time believing him unless he could prove it somehow.

More importantly, you can prove the treasure exists. From your explanation, it sounded like all three people were outside the walls with the treasure inside. But if that were the case, then the others would merely need to look through the walls the same way and they would be able to see the treasure too.

But that's too easy so lets assume he is inside the walls with the treasure, and the others are outside, unable to look past the walls. The guy inside could grab some treasure, leave the way he came and then show it to the others. He could pull out his phone and take pictures. He could throw pieces of treasure high above the walls to the outside. He could throw treasure against the walls so the others could hear the sound. Whatever he did to reach that treasure chest, he could give directions to the others so they could also get there. There are so many ways to prove it. The fact that it really exists helps a lot.

Now lets assume that instead of treasure, the man was claiming that the tooth fairy was behind the walls. When the outsiders ask for some kind of proof, the man inside says "What's wrong with you? How come you don't automatically believe me? Don't tell me that you haven't seen the tooth fairy before. What, do you think that the tooth fairy being here is strange or something? Why would you doubt me at all? I told you that the tooth fairy is in here, so you should believe me without question."

The men outside are dumbfounded, and after a few minutes, they ask if they could come see the tooth fairy too. The man inside says "Uh... No, wait! You can't come in here!" but despite his pleading, the other two men manage to clear the walls and join the guy inside.

"So where is the tooth fairy? There's nobody here besides us."
"Uh, the tooth fairy is still here but she is invisible."

Who is logical and who is batshit insane in this story?

[Weekend_Warrior]

I'd like to request that this thread be closed now. Thanks

[vash23n]

So extremist atheists and extremist religious are both bad because they tend to hold so tightly to their own beliefs that they become as close minded as they accuse the other of being. They tend to treat the other with ignorance and hostility because they feel their own belief or lack there of is constantly being challenged and it is up to them to defend it.

Can we be done with this now? I feel like you are all saying the same thing just the opposite perspective. The last few posts are like this:

"Well I don't believe or not believe in this, but I find that most people who do believe or don't believe this tend to be overly nutty and say hurtful things because they are defensive."

"Well I believe or don't believe in this, but I find that most people who don't believe or do believe this tend to be overly nutty and say hurtful things because they are defensive."

blah blah blah... I haven't had a conversation this cyclical since I was a history major and argued politics with political science majors because history majors tend to look at the past when shaping their political mind (learning from mistakes and such) and political science majors tend to look at the present (living for today and the future). Eventually you need to just realized that no one is right when they try to force their beliefs on others. You can stand by what you believe and respond honestly when asked. You can also have civilized discussions with the idea that both parties may learn something about the other (even if they don't change their stance), but you can't just start preaching and get angry when someone else doesn't change their stance - no matter what side of any particular issue you happen to reside.

Sssooo... when do you guys think the new Zelda game is coming out for the Wii...

[Dylan]

So extremist atheists and extremist religious are both bad because they tend to hold so tightly to their own beliefs that they become as close minded as they accuse the other of being. They tend to treat the other with ignorance and hostility because they feel their own belief or lack there of is constantly being challenged and it is up to them to defend it.

Can we be done with this now? I feel like you are all saying the same thing just the opposite perspective. The last few posts are like this:

"Well I don't believe or not believe in this, but I find that most people who do believe or don't believe this tend to be overly nutty and say hurtful things because they are defensive."

"Well I believe or don't believe in this, but I find that most people who don't believe or do believe this tend to be overly nutty and say hurtful things because they are defensive."

blah blah blah... I haven't had a conversation this cyclical since I was a history major and argued politics with political science majors because history majors tend to look at the past when shaping their political mind (learning from mistakes and such) and political science majors tend to look at the present (living for today and the future). Eventually you need to just realized that no one is right when they try to force their beliefs on others. You can stand by what you believe and respond honestly when asked. You can also have civilized discussions with the idea that both parties may learn something about the other (even if they don't change their stance), but you can't just start preaching and get angry when someone else doesn't change their stance - no matter what side of any particular issue you happen to reside.

Sssooo... when do you guys think the new Zelda game is coming out for the Wii...

As soon as Nintendo releases more cryptic, non descriptive concept art.

[RCBH928]

Inazuma

I am not sure why did you change the analogy.
The whole point was to prove this
1)If you do not know and need proof, that is ok
2)If some one comes with a claim that he can't prove then do not laugh at him or accuse him of lying because you too have a claim but you can't prove it either.

I am not sure how is this wrong, seems very logical to me. Both parties can't prove their claim scientifically , then no one should make fun of the other. They are equal in claim.

*****out of discussion and just for fun*****

I am not sure about this,
But does the Bible refer to some kind of ghosts or spirits?
If it does then it claims something for over 2000 years that science can't prove.

If I showed you a ghost, will it be enough evidence for you that God exists?

This is not for argument or anything, just for fun and wondering if it happens will it be enough.

[Luke]

You know what I believe?

[MrPopo]

I have to agree with vash23n, this discussion just keeps going in circles. It reminds me of the time my Hebrew school class went to a church to debate with a Sunday school class.

I'm going to close this down. Feel free to continue your discussion through PMs.