The Wrestling Thread

[Reprise]

RVD's frog splash is amazing. I have always loved it as well. The old Smackdown games absolutely nailed the animation for it too, so he was always one of my favourite wrestlers to play as.

The rest I would struggle to disagree with. I can't really think of any examples of who I feel executes particular moves the best, but I have also always liked HBK's superkick the best. Nobody else pulls it off like him.

[Raging Justice]

This is fascinating, there's reports of Giulia becoming the female face of NXT and getting an "Asuka" push. What's interesting is that SHE WILL STILL BE WORKING FOR MARIGOLD!

That's one hell of a deal. Also, Roxanne Perez is getting prepared for her eventual match with Giulia. This is going to be an important match when it happens. I've never been as high on Giulia as a lot people are, but I do find all of this very interesting. Don't get me wrong, she's very talented and it'll be interesting seeing what she does with this push. I'm not knocking her talent or star power, I've just always been more of a Tam Nakano person. My bias is showing

[Fightful Select] Giulia-WWE Update
WWE sources say the company are comfortable with Giulia healing while remaining in Japan and are not expected to interfere with her desire to still appear on shows she was originally scheduled to wrestle on.

Officials expect Giulia to make her first appearance for the brand before she makes the permanent move to the United States along with her family.

On NXT Heatwave, as we have previously reported, while WWE have been hopeful to make Giulia vs Roxanne Perez happen at the Toronto event, it has always been dependent on Giulia’s Marigold dates and now, her injury status.By no means has the match been made official, nor has it been close to being locked in as of this writing. NXT sources Brennan spoke to insist however that regardless of if Giulia will make her debut at NXT Heatwave, officials in NXT are dead set on making an NXT Women’s Championship title clash with Roxanne Perez happen upon Giulia’s debut within the company.

NXT general manager Ava will play a key role in how Giulia makes her NXT television debut and that Roxanne has been working stiffer at live events in preparation for the matchup.

Both WWE and Marigold sources confirmed to us that Giulia will not be exclusive to NXT and WWE for quite a while, if at all and that working with Marigold was a sticking point in her negotiations to sign with the promotion back in April.

Giulia is expected to be the female face of the NXT brand, with one source expecting her to surpass what Asuka achieved during her stint on the brand.

[Reprise]

1. Mercedes Moné defeats Willow Nightingale (Singles match for the AEW TBS Championship)
2. Roderick Strong defeats Will Ospreay (Singles match for the AEW International Championship)
3. "Timeless" Toni Storm defeats Serena Deeb (Singles match for the AEW Women's World Championship
4. Swerve Strickland defeats Christian Cage (Singles match for the AEW World Championship)
5. The Elite - Kazuchika Okada, Jack Perry, Matthew Jackson, and Nicholas Jackson defeat Team AEW - Bryan Danielson, Cash Wheeler, Dax Harwood, and Darby Allin (Anarchy in the Arena match)
6. Malakai Black defeats Adam Copeland (Barbed Wire Steel Cage match for the AEW TNT Championship)
7. Konosuke Takeshita defeats Jon Moxley (IWGP World Heavyweight Championship Eliminator match -
If Takeshita wins, he will receive a future IWGP World Heavyweight Championship match)
8. Orange Cassidy defeats Trent Beretta (Singles match)
9. Chris Jericho defeats Shibata and Hook (Singles match for the FTW Championship)

Might have to alter my predictions here.

Roderick Strong will retain. Will will refuse to hit the tiger driver, then lose his focus, which will give Roderick the opening he needs to catch him off guard and retain. Edit: Also, he gets kicked out of the Don Callis family.

Takeshita, I will take a punt on.

Jericho will retain too. That's why it's a triple threat, to protect Hook and keep the belt on Jericho. They wouldn't start a new gimmick ("The Learning Tree") if he was going to lose so quickly and piss off. Big Bill will interfere too.

Maybe it's not so predictable, since I am second guessing myself

Edit: Oh, there's now Bullet Club Gold vs Death Triangle. I will go with Death Triangle I think. Then we might see Jay White embarking on more of a singles push again.

[Raging Justice]

1. Mercedes Moné defeats Willow Nightingale (Singles match for the AEW TBS Championship)
2. Roderick Strong defeats Will Ospreay (Singles match for the AEW International Championship)
3. "Timeless" Toni Storm defeats Serena Deeb (Singles match for the AEW Women's World Championship
4. Swerve Strickland defeats Christian Cage (Singles match for the AEW World Championship)
5. The Elite - Kazuchika Okada, Jack Perry, Matthew Jackson, and Nicholas Jackson defeat Team AEW - Bryan Danielson, Cash Wheeler, Dax Harwood, and Darby Allin (Anarchy in the Arena match)
6. Malakai Black defeats Adam Copeland (Barbed Wire Steel Cage match for the AEW TNT Championship)
7. Konosuke Takeshita defeats Jon Moxley (IWGP World Heavyweight Championship Eliminator match -
If Takeshita wins, he will receive a future IWGP World Heavyweight Championship match)
8. Orange Cassidy defeats Trent Beretta (Singles match)
9. Chris Jericho defeats Shibata and Hook (Singles match for the FTW Championship)

Might have to alter my predictions here.

Roderick Strong will retain. Will will refuse to hit the tiger driver, then lose his focus, which will give Roderick the opening he needs to catch him off guard and retain. Edit: Also, he gets kicked out of the Don Callis family.

Takeshita, I will take a punt on.

Jericho will retain too. That's why it's a triple threat, to protect Hook and keep the belt on Jericho. They wouldn't start a new gimmick ("The Learning Tree") if he was going to lose so quickly and piss off. Big Bill will interfere too.

Maybe it's not so predictable, since I am second guessing myself

Edit: Oh, there's now Bullet Club Gold vs Death Triangle. I will go with Death Triangle I think. Then we might see Jay White embarking on more of a singles push again.

The weird thing about the FTW title situation is these segments with Samoa Joe kind of chastising Hook and Shibata. That's way more interesting than anything about Jericho and I'm not entirely sure where they're going with it.

The trios title match. Sigh. I honestly think both White AND Pac should be getting singles pushes. Nothing against Fenix and Pentagon, but at this point I feel like they are dragging Pac down.

Takeshita vs Mox is so utterly pointless.

I'm not feeling Double or Nothing, but I'll tell you what could save it for me:

Mercedes and Willow having a banger of a match, and then AEW IMMEDIATELY setting something up for Mercedes after she wins the belt. Hell, I wish Kamille or Britt Baker would show up and attack her or something.

Hangman showing up during Anarchy in the Arena, then showing up AGAIN during Swerve/Christian

Christian wins the title with help from Hangman, but there's controversy...like the ref didn't see Swerve's foot on the rope or something, the referees are arguing and Hangman and Christian both look like they are about to lose their goddamn minds. The result of the match is left in question as the show goes off the air

[Reprise]

I'm not feeling Double or Nothing, but I'll tell you what could save it for me:

Mercedes and Willow having a banger of a match, and then AEW IMMEDIATELY setting something up for Mercedes after she wins the belt. Hell, I wish Kamille or Britt Baker would show up and attack her or something.

Hangman showing up during Anarchy in the Arena, then showing up AGAIN during Swerve/Christian

Christian wins the title with help from Hangman, but there's controversy...like the ref didn't see Swerve's foot on the rope or something, the referees are arguing and Hangman and Christian both look like they are about to lose their goddamn minds. The result of the match is left in question as the show goes off the air

Funnily enough, I was thinking the same two things would save it for me. I was watching the hype package for Mercedes vs Willow that AEW put out, as well as a few podcasts/youtube shows talking about the match, and it made me look forward to it more than the actual build did. They have a real opportunity here to prove their detractors wrong and put on a an absolute banger as you say. And then do something shocking to set up her next angle.

I would love to see Hangman show up in either or both matches. I like what you have there with Swerve and Christian. Fans will chant "bullshit", but the story will be great and it does exactly what we were discussing the other day - it ends on a cliffhanger and makes the next Dynamite must-see television.

[Reprise]

Is Jack going to get set on fire?

https://imgur.com/a/qH9EnGj

[Raging Justice]

Everyone needs to remember what kinds of questions are allowed at WWE press events




Paul = "I'm so glad you asked that, bought off, paid shill"

[Raging Justice]

I've said a lot about Tony Kahn being bad at PR, but triple H has gotten a bit of flack from some fans for that press event a little while ago where that reported dared to ask a legit question. These are some comments from reddit:

"WWE PR is frighteningly good at their job.

People on the internet are convinced they can do no wrong. They’re a defendant in the Grant civil suit, they’re only strengthening their ties with Saudi Arabia, and Triple H bombs every remotely difficult question he’s asked in a presser and throws the press under the bus. Yet people will ignore this stuff, gloss over it, or even defend it. They’ve successfully weaponized the tribalism in the community so that people see no faults (for what it’s worth I’m sure AEW would do the same thing if they had the resources).

I like WWE quite a bit but it’s frustrating how little they seem to be taken to task for all this by the fans. Any remote criticism of the product is handwaved away by “look at how much money they’re making”

Just screaming into the void here because it’s obvious none of this is changing anytime soon. It’s a new era!"

"Seriously guys these aren’t real press conferences they are there for cute kayfabe promos and then for you to suck off Hunter’s ego for 30 minutes since he can’t get that in ring anymore."

- "Hey be fair to HHH, he also can't do twenty minute Wrestlemania entrances anymore where he imitates his favorite movies."

- "Just fuckin watch him! The Paul Levesque Era is now!"

"HHH crumbles under any question that isn't glazing him up and then acts like a child lashing out at people.

"That's why they had to go into kiss ass mode with SRS and Mike Johnson to make things right so they can feed them more propaganda like the last releases were nicer than before.

Nether of them should believe the apology because HHH will just do it again when ask something that is harder to answer than "why was this the best show ever?"

"Dealt with big-league sports teams for 20 years as a sports reporter. Top-level sports PR people are the absolute worst. Just slimy in every possible way you can imagine. Literally in all my years of doing that stuff, the only people I'd still like to tell off to this very day are a few PR people I dealt with."

"Also remember Ronda who is a dipshit in her own right took a fucking POUNDING for calling him out in her book recently."

"the only approved questions are 'Wow, how does it feel to break your gate record for this venue?', 'Hey I'm from ____ when will my country get a PLE?, and 'There's talk of this being a new era, can you tell us what we can expect from that?'

The answers are 'It feels good, thank you to the fans for turning out', 'Oh we're always listening and evaluating our options, if you want a PLE, be loud!', and 'We're in the business of telling stories that really connect to our audience, look for more long-term stories' and those answers are the same every time."

My favorite one:

"There's only one word to describe wwe and its PR and I'm gonna spell it out for ya. S-A-W-F-T!"

[Raging Justice]

Interesting comments from a recent pwtorch article:

"The TBS Champion would successfully defend her title against Taya Valkyrie at the Double or Nothing PPV before immediately accepting a challenge from a returning Kris Statlander. An already embattled Cargill was then toppled in just 50 seconds, losing her title and perfect record in the process. This felt like an ignominious way for a centerpiece act to lose and for a long term storyline to be paid off.

True, Statlander gained some fleeting credit, but the historic victory wasn’t featured on AEW television in the weeks that followed and Statlander now feels no higher on the AEW depth chart. Cargill herself disappeared from AEW television for the next several months so no immediate narrative benefit was gained.

Given the lack of official word from either AEW or Cargill herself, it’s difficult to pinpoint the exact reason for her departure. Was AEW a stepping stone to Cargill’s true first choice? Did AEW run out of ideas on how to portray a star they had built from the ground up? Either and both could be true.

It was clear early on in Cargill’s AEW run that the undefeated trope could only take her character so far. More narrative attention was needed to raise Cargill’s stature in the eyes of the causal fan and AEW simply did not give her the opportunity to develop beyond her sheer presence.

I would argue that the lesson here is to strike while the iron’s hot. There have been numerous opportunities when AEW has had lightning in a bottle – such as Cody Rhodes, “Hangman” Page, Hook, Daniel Garcia, and C.M. Punk – only to squander the clear fan interest at its peak. With ratings and live show attendances stagnating, AEW simply cannot pass up another clear future centerpiece act. The current example is Will Ospreay. The “Aerial Assassin” is white hot and should be built around as the must-see prospect of a new era. Jade Cargill could have been that star for the AEW Women’s Division, but for whatever reason that opportunity was missed.

Cargill didn’t significantly feud with Britt Baker, Jamie Hayter, Saraya, Toni Storm, Serena Deeb, or Thunder Rosa during her time in All Elite. Often kept in her own narrative universe on Rampage, Cargill soon stagnated. A frequent (and fair) criticism of the AEW roster is that they stay in their own fiefdoms, rarely venturing out to create new and interesting matches. With such a significant roster, AEW has to break this perception and mix its roster to create fresh and intriguing matches."

[Reprise]

I am glad you brought up WWE's press events and specifically Paul's terrible responses to anything that is even marginally deeper than just fluffy praise for how "marvellous" WWE is.

I have noticed the same. What's weird though, is with how tribalistic the online wrestling community is, it has created almost political like discourse and cultish behaviour. It's like how certain populist leaders who have gained popularity over the last 10 years or so, whose followers don't like them being held to account and constantly defend them and call everything they don't like "fake news".

I saw a report the other day about how WWE essentially just wants softball questions at these press events and they want to avoid difficult questions. It's a bad look, yet most people's responses were defending WWE and Triple H and attacking journalists and the wrestling media.

Sorry, but what? That's just batshit. Acting like the media doesn't have a right to criticise or ask difficult questions.

The pwtorch article is good and I agree with it. That is a big issue AEW has. They frequently drop the ball when they have potential stars on their hands and they also often book them into their own little compartmentalised universes that imposes a glass ceiling above them. It's frustrating as a fan. Sometimes the flow of their shows, particularly from one to the next, aren't always particularly cohesive. It's hard to explain.

I don't think the belts help either.

Back in the day in WWE and WCW, it was simple, but everyone understood there was a general trajectory for a wrestler moving up the card. It went:

Light Heavyweight -> European -> Intercontinental -> World Champion

And then you had the Tag Team titles, Hardcore title and Women's title.

AEW has all these different titles but I couldn't order them in importance. They're just a jumbled mess. And don't even get me started on the fact they also have ROH belts on AEW television and AEW stars.

They should unify some titles and make it more obvious which are lower, lower middle, upper middle and upper card titles.