The Wrestling Thread

[Raging Justice]

Also, fuck Cody Rhodes and fuck CM Punk

I don't know if I've said it before, but Cody leaving AEW hurt the company. I really believe that. It hurt the perception of AEW as this awesome place where everyone is happy. One of the founders of the company leaving was a bad look for AEW. Things only got worse after that with the CM Punk drama and some other stuff going on behind the scenes.

AEW's reputation is not the same as it was back around 2020-2021. Cody and Punk have done significant damage to it, and it seems like Punk's antics and Cody leaving led to a lot of other backstage fiascos too. For a while, it was like every week we were hearing about behind the scenes problems in AEW. Of course, some of the blame has to go to Tony Kahn too.

Remember when everyone wanted to go to AEW? With Cody leaving and getting his mega push, things have gone in the opposite direction. Now it feels like WWE is the place to be for AEW wrestlers. Cody set the precedent. Now Jade Cargill left and is getting a mega push, and others will soon follow. I was talking with someone the other day about how WWE is getting ready to try and sign a bunch of AEW wrestlers and he said, "Well yeah, after seeing what WWE did with Cody of course people will want to leave AEW now"

Fuck you Cody. You used The Elite and you used AEW just so you could go back to WWE like the prodigal son and be treated like a bigger star than you were when you left. Before AEW, before Tony Kahn, Hangman, Omega, and the Young Bucks, Cody was this guy:

[Raging Justice]

Fitting that on this night, WWE opens up NXT with the traitor. They know what they're doing.

[RCBH928]

Whenever I see people say stuff like "ah, so Edge isn't a draw" or "CM Punk isn't a draw", "Bryan Danielson isn't a draw" or "The Elite aren't a draw", I think it's flawed logic though. AEW isn't a draw. The issue isn't the stars, it's the product. AEW is just kinda stale at the moment.

as if WWE has a great product. IMO WWE sucks. Maybe I am out of touch with the modern times but stuff from 1990 up to 2001 is probably better than the current WWE product. Roman Reigns is like the most boring champion ever. Roster wise, AEW seems more interesting to me. I mean I'd watch Moxley, Edge, Dustin Rhodes, Cage, and Jericho over whatever is in WWE now.

Although I have to say that even if I was head of AEW/WWE I wouldn't know what to serve the fans because I have no idea what the current fan base would be interested in.

Just checked AEW roster and they have Bryan Danielson in there, wasn't this guy with the "yes yes yes" chants and supposed to be the most popular wrestler in WWE? how is it going for him in AEW?

[Raging Justice]

Whenever I see people say stuff like "ah, so Edge isn't a draw" or "CM Punk isn't a draw", "Bryan Danielson isn't a draw" or "The Elite aren't a draw", I think it's flawed logic though. AEW isn't a draw. The issue isn't the stars, it's the product. AEW is just kinda stale at the moment.

as if WWE has a great product. IMO WWE sucks. Maybe I am out of touch with the modern times but stuff from 1990 up to 2001 is probably better than the current WWE product. Roman Reigns is like the most boring champion ever. Roster wise, AEW seems more interesting to me. I mean I'd watch Moxley, Edge, Dustin Rhodes, Cage, and Jericho over whatever is in WWE now.

Although I have to say that even if I was head of AEW/WWE I wouldn't know what to serve the fans because I have no idea what the current fan base would be interested in.

Just checked AEW roster and they have Bryan Danielson in there, wasn't this guy with the "yes yes yes" chants and supposed to be the most popular wrestler in WWE? how is it going for him in AEW?

Danielson is popular there, and he has had some incredible matches in AEW that can easily be considered all time classics. He can do certain things in the ring that he couldn't do in WWE because AEW gives their wrestlers more freedom in the ring. However, some fans feel that AEW haven't pushed Bryan hard enough and have allowed him to lose too many matches. It's incredible that he has not held a single title yet in AEW and he may be retiring soon. That is mind boggling and makes you question Tony Kahn's sanity. It can be argued that AEW has not made the most of what they have in Bryan. I could argue part of this was due to Tony Kahn being too obsessed with CM Punk, pushing him over other top guys like Bryan Danielson and Hangman Adam Page. Kahn has nothing to show for it now with Punk being fired (and could potentially even return to WWE, though that would make Punk the ultimate hypocrite). Also, Bryan has had this problem of flip flopping back and forth between face and heel too many times. I personally don't think Bryan should ever be a heel. He can play the part just fine, but I feel like fans always want to cheer for him instead of boo him. He was probably the most popular face WWE has had in the past decade, eclipsing even John Cena (though WWE will never admit that). Bryan is just a natural face.

The yes chants that he made popular in WWE still get used by WWE fans today as well as current AEW fans, and they even get used in some other wrestling companies too, which is incredible. In fact, LA Knight fans are even doing a variation of it with "Yeah" chants, since LA Knight says "yeah" a lot. I think the yes chants are going to be part of Bryan's legacy long after he has stopped performing, much like Steven Austin's "What?" chants that you still hear sometimes at WWE shows.

[Reprise]

Bryan Danielson has gone on record saying he doesn't want championships in AEW at this point in his career and that he went there to help new talent and basically do the kind of matches and work with the people he just couldn't do in WWE. I really think he should have beaten Adam Page for the title on Dynamite and have Page beat him in the rematch. Maybe even have them main event Revolution 2022 instead of... who was it? Adam Cole and Page?

I think him flip flopping between face and heel is what hurt him the most though. There's never any rhyme or reason for it either. I agree, he is a character who should never be heel, because fans will never want to boo him. Some people are just natural baby faces and natural heels and he is a face.

[Raging Justice]

Bryan Danielson has gone on record saying he doesn't want championships in AEW at this point in his career and that he went there to help new talent and basically do the kind of matches and work with the people he just couldn't do in WWE. I really think he should have beaten Adam Page for the title on Dynamite and have Page beat him in the rematch. Maybe even have them main event Revolution 2022 instead of... who was it? Adam Cole and Page?

I think him flip flopping between face and heel is what hurt him the most though. There's never any rhyme or reason for it either. I agree, he is a character who should never be heel, because fans will never want to boo him. Some people are just natural baby faces and natural heels and he is a face.

I agree. You know Bryan has the opposite problem of Punk. Phil wants it all, Bryan on the other hand, lacks ambition.

So maybe Markies was on to something, there's word going round that Triple H is being given 90% of creative control of WWE. Vince's voice will still be heard as he will never get his fingers off of WWE until he's in the grave, but it seems like Endeavor is putting a lot of faith in Triple H. This past Raw felt like a Triple H show. A lot of his favorites were getting screen time including a title match between Teagon Nox and Becky Lynch. I don't know what's going on behind the scenes at WWE, but Triple H and Vince both seem like very stubborn guys fighting for control and Triple H seems to have pulled ahead at least when it comes to creative.

I'm not gonna love everything Triple H does, but I'd rather him in charge than Vince.

Tony Kahn needs to start getting his shit together NOW. Triple H is a guy who plans ahead and is organized...unlike Tony Kahn.

I had fun switching channels between AEW and WWE this Tuesday night. I WANT this. I want both companies to take the gloves off and stop pretending they don't hate each other. Competition always benefits the fans. Without competition, companies do whatever the fuck they want. When there IS competition, they are trying to make US happy. This is GOOD. WWE doesn't give a fuck about its fans, but they'll try to win us over just to make AEW look bad. With that in mind, I hope AEW finds a way to light a fire under its product again. The more WWE and AEW dual with each other the better it is for us.

I was not expecting Cassidy to get his title back. I like this. I like Fenix, but he was gonna be a boring champion. I hope Cassidy actually beats Mox now, pushing him to the next level and then you can do all kinds of fun things going forward with Cassidy as champ.

Shida is the women's champion again. Holy shit! Feels like Dynamite this week is course correcting and putting the titles where they actually belong.

What's with people in AEW pretending to be champion? First Christian, now Jay White? I like the Jay White/MJF feud as absurd at it is. I just remembered Cole is injured, so now we got MJF in an actual singles, title feud. This is a good thing.

I HATE Hangman losing to Jay White again. I would have preferred they just didn't do this match. Isn't Hangman supposed to be feuding with Swerve anyway? This is what I hate with AEW. They can't keep a guy looking strong...unless his name is Moxley or CM Punk

Damn, Jericho put Hobbs over HARD.

Nice promo from Christian, but that's to be expected at this point. I don't know if a feud with Christian was the best thing to have Edge do first in AEW, but Christian is making it entertaining.

Some bright spots on Dynamite, but AEW is still in a bad place and WWE is really heating up right now. Of note is NXT's women's division, which is really starting to impress me. AEW needs to really make their people feel like a bigger deal. NXT had nothing really meaningful happen, but it felt star studded with Cody, LA Knight, Undertaker, Cena, etc.

Funny random thought I had, Toni Storm's new gimmick is AWFUL. However, I think she'd be over in NXT ironically. Historically, NXT crowds are the nicest ones in WWE and will cheer almost anything.

Oh and one last thing, Cena has actually not aggravated me since his return. He is being used well for the most part, but goddamn it I am so sick and tired of hearing, "The Greatest of All Time". They are STILL doing this.

[Reprise]

Isn't Toni's new gimmick massively over in AEW? It is in all the online wrestling spaces I visit anyways, on Reddit, Facebook and on forums. You are the first person I have seen call it anything less than great haha.

[Reprise]

I haven't seen Dynamite yet, but have seen clips and read about the overbooked ending with all the various run ins. I don't understand why AEW does those so much? They did it a month or so ago with Bullet Club Gold, the Elite and FTR I think. And it just seems a bit silly to me. To me, it feels like they lack the ability to tell a compelling story or they don't really know how to proceed with the show, so they just throw everything at a segment, thinking it will make the crowd pop and people at home get excited. But sometimes (well often) with wrestling, less is more.

[Raging Justice]

Isn't Toni's new gimmick massively over in AEW? It is in all the online wrestling spaces I visit anyways, on Reddit, Facebook and on forums. You are the first person I have seen call it anything less than great haha.

I think AEW fans are desperate to find something to praise in AEW's women's division. So they're latching on to this stupid Toni Storm thing. It's desperation. Unless I missed something, she's not getting massive pops from the crowds.

Anybody can do an overly dramatic actor/actress gimmick, it's not particularly clever or original. Also, to be frank, Toni Storm is not pretty enough to try and pull off some Marilyn Monroe act, and she's not exactly a natural when it comes to comedy either. Being funny is an art, and not everyone can pull if off. Simply acting stupid in front of a camera doesn't automatically equal funny. She has no comedic timing or nuance whatsoever. In fact, the whole entertainers from a different era gimmick has been done better in wrestling:





Tony Storm ain't got nothing on that shit. What she's doing is cringe and I've watched some of her segments with casuals...they were not laughing. It was more like that uncomfortable feeling in the room when everyone knows what they're watching is really dumb.

I haven't seen Dynamite yet, but have seen clips and read about the overbooked ending with all the various run ins. I don't understand why AEW does those so much? They did it a month or so ago with Bullet Club Gold, the Elite and FTR I think. And it just seems a bit silly to me. To me, it feels like they lack the ability to tell a compelling story or they don't really know how to proceed with the show, so they just throw everything at a segment, thinking it will make the crowd pop and people at home get excited. But sometimes (well often) with wrestling, less is more.

I was a bit confused with that ending. AEW these days is all about throwing lots of shit at a wall and seeing what sticks. They can't commit to anything when it comes to pushes or story telling. Brian Pillman Jr. had one video on this week's NXT and it was better than EVERYTHING he was doing in AEW. They know what they're doing over there in WWE...at least when Triple H and his buddies are running things. I forgot all about Pillman going there with all the talk surrounding Jade Cargill

On a completely unrelated note, I've been loving Shinsuke Nakamura these past few weeks in WWE. He's like a ninja, samurai, Michael Jackson with nunchuks (he was twirling them around like Bruce Lee in his match with Seth Rollins), a Japanese Katana (he was sitting next to one in a video segment like two weeks ago), and now he's even using Japanese mist. I love when Japanese wrestlers use that, it's real ninja shit

Him and Asuka both used the mist on last weekend's pay per view, each with a different color too

[Raging Justice]

I think AEW's women's division has gained nothing of value from the washed up WWE castoffs, including Toni Storm. The most popular and best women they have are the AEW originals, the joshis (when they are available), and a few non-AEW talents like Nightingale. Now I will change my tune if they get Mercedes Mone, but Soho, Saraya, and Storm suck.

There's a reason no one cared when they left WWE. There are far better women in WWE and AEW can't get them.