So what have you guys been watching lately?

[REPO Man]

And I bet many of those families will just tune to Cartoon Network to shut their kids up and that's why ratings for Teen Titans Go was high enough to at one point dominate the schedule. And I'm almost certain that is not unlike how Ridiculousness ended up dominating MTV's schedule.

[marurun]

Firefly literally got cancelled due to low ratings because Fox aired episodes out of order, and yet has found a loyal fanbase BEFORE it got cancelled.

That sounds like speculation. I've seen the series and I don't think proper airing order would have had that much impact. Even if it HAD had an impact, the show got very poor ratings and didn't justify either its cost or its timeslot. They didn't even make it to the end of the first season.[/quote]

And the AI bullshit? IIRC a judge revealed that anything made by an AI can't be trademarked or copyrighted so the studios can't just use AI to same money. It's like self-checkout stands at the store, in that even though they won't demand fair wages or workers' rights, the benefits don't necessarily outweigh the risks.

I'm not sure that precedent will remain, at least in full form. I suspect the courts will soften on AI a bit over time and carve out some spaces in which it can be copyrighted.

Basically, REPO, your posts here are reading like a personal rant that seriously fails to understand markets and audiences. Of COURSE studios sometimes screw up. The entertainment business isn't perfect by any stretch. But your selective complaints about all the shows YOU like seem to assume some kind of mass appeal that, frankly, those shows don't have and are unlikely to ever have. "What I don't like about..." and "What's wrong with..." are so rarely actually the same thing on the internet.

[Ziggy]

Because their metrics and analytics showed that the likely return on advertising investment was higher with shows in category X than with shows in category Y.

But that's exactly it. They shoved those two Dahmer series down America's throat. And I've seen at least one or two other murder / serial killer series or specials being heavily promoted (suggested) when they were new. If you search "serial killer" on NetFlix, you can see that they have a shit ton of original content in the murder or serial killer category. They have been investing heavily in this type of show. So we're not talking about NetFlix heavily promoting family sitcoms while serial killer stuff gets swept under the rug. They very much promote serial killer shows and specials. But for whatever reason they didn't with Mind Hunters. NetFlix did not make me aware of Mind Hunters while the two seasons were new. I only happened to stumble upon it some time after the second (and last) season was already out. It's like they didn't want it to succeed.

[MrPopo]

Well, Mindhunter came out 5 years prior to Dahmer, and was not renewed 2 years prior to Dahmer. There's a lot that can change in that time, such as market trends. Additionally, the two shows have different focuses; based on my reading of wikipedia Mindhunter is more about the investigators across a variety of serial killers, while Dahmer is about a serial killer as the protagonist. So even if the two shows go head to head, there isn't necessarily a "if you like one you'll like the other".

[Limewater]

But that's exactly it. They shoved those two Dahmer series down America's throat.

For what it's worth, I did not directly experience much Dahmer promotion. I am wondering if Netflix's viewer algorithm determined somehow that you would be interested.

To be clear, though, I am only talking about the promos that play at the top of the screen upon login to Netflix. I haven't encountered a lot of Netflix promos outside of Netflix itself, but I don't really watch normal TV anymore. You may be talking about general advertising.

I do think Netflix has a different set of priorities than movie studios and traditional networks, though. They benefit greatly from new subscribers. Their costs for delivering the most popular content are a little bit lower, though I don't know how big a factor this is, and they actually benefit most from people subscribing but not watching all that much.

[Ziggy]

I do think Netflix has a different set of priorities than movie studios and traditional networks, though. They benefit greatly from new subscribers. Their costs for delivering the most popular content are a little bit lower, though I don't know how big a factor this is, and they actually benefit most from people subscribing but not watching all that much.

If that's true, then they should know that I am now way less likely to watch any continuing series by NetFlix knowing that it might end like that. I mean, that's such an annoying thing to deal with. Maybe I'm turning into a cranky old man. But I have many other things I can fill my time up with. Investing my time in a show that might get shit canned, I can find better ways to spend my leisure time.

[MrPopo]

Investing my time in a show that might get shit canned, I can find better ways to spend my leisure time.

But that's literally been every TV show ever produced. You weren't even guaranteed a full season's run if it did bad enough.

[Ziggy]

Talking about when shows aired on cable, yes, shows got canceled more often than not. But that's not really the same thing. Even then, there were always those "big" shows that you could be reasonably sure wouldn't be canceled before it could wrap itself up. And so many shows didn't really have a strong story arc that went through the entire series (not like today, people have come to expect that) so it didn't sting nearly as bad if the show was canceled. Even mid season.

Original content from streaming services felt like they were a higher caliber. But from what you just said, I guess I should have noticed they're adopting the cable TV method. Throw a bunch of shit against the wall and see what sticks.

You could say I'm just being bitchy and kind of unreasonable because I liked that show and it was canceled. And you wouldn't be wrong. But I still feel like I have a valid point. NetFlix has clearly been pushing these crime dramas and series or specials regarding murderers and serial killers. So to find a show on NetFlix that has some decent actors and good names attached like David Fincher, I don't think it's unfair to expect to invest your time in the show with good faith that it would be wrapped up properly and not canceled prematurely.

And to be clear, Mindhunters wasn't just flat out canceled after the second season. The second season set up a third, and by all accounts a third seasons was on the way. Then it was reported that production would be put on hold until Fincher finished a film he was working on. Then to quote Wikipedia, "A Netflix spokesperson stated, "He may revisit Mindhunter again in the future, but in the meantime felt it wasn't fair to the actors to hold them from seeking other work while he was exploring new work of his own."" So now Fincher and the actors are all busy with other things. So this makes it sound like NetFlix had interest in the third season but Fincher was too busy with other stuff. Then to further quote Wiki "In October 2020, Fincher confirmed the series was done for now, and a Netflix spokesperson said that a third season may be possible "maybe in five years"." Then just recently Fincher said a third season will never happen so stop asking (this is what prompted me to bitch about this, because I just learned of this). Cost was one of the things referenced as a problem area for producing the show, but other reasons were given as well. So it's not as simple as "NetFlix bean counters deemed it too costly for the number of viewers and canceled it." It sounds like NetFlix did have interest in continuing the show. I'm just saying, if production cost couldn't be justified from viewership, that's kind of bullshit since they didn't seem to promote the show a whole lot like they do for other shows with similar subject matter.

[MrPopo]

Honestly, it all sounds like everyone involved kind of lost interest over time.

[Ziggy]

Well, add it to the list of great shows that were canceled before concluding.

I would still recommend to anyone to watch it. The second season might set up the third very well, but it's not a horrible cliff hanger. The two seasons are solid and very enjoyable. The show picks up in the late 70s and follows some FBI agents as they sort of invent profiling. It's a fun ride to go along with them on. You get to see them come up with the name "sequence killers" and then eventually "serial killers." The show is rooted in reality, based off of a non-fiction book written by an ex-FBI agent. If you're into true crime and serial killer stuff, I'd say it's a must watch. Which is why it's baffling that it doesn't seem to pop up as a recommended show.