Summer Games Challenge 2018 - begin when ready!

[lordb0rb4]

Nice man, despite owning a bunch of them, i've never actually finished any FF before, maybe in another summer challenge.

[MrPopo]

I don't really like FF VI, and I've got an old save file from the PS1 version that's been sitting at the end of the world for a decade and a half, but I'm feeling somewhat compelled to play the Super Famicom version.

The PS1 version of VI really hurts the game, because of the crazy load times. So please give the SFC/SNES version a try before you write off the game.

[pierrot]

i've never actually finished any FF before, maybe in another summer challenge.

No kidding? You're probably bound to be more successful with your current method of not including longer games like RPGs on your summer challenge lists, though.

I don't really like FF VI, and I've got an old save file from the PS1 version that's been sitting at the end of the world for a decade and a half, but I'm feeling somewhat compelled to play the Super Famicom version.

The PS1 version of VI really hurts the game, because of the crazy load times. So please give the SFC/SNES version a try before you write off the game.

So, you're suggesting that I play Dragon Quest VI and Final Fantasy VI side-by-side for an ultimate showdown of the sixes?

I'm somewhat open to giving FF VI another shot, but it wasn't the load times that I didn't like about it--not like the PS1 version of IV where I couldn't even stand to play up to the spoony bard, although I did manage to soldier through replaying CT on the PS1. I don't care for the proto-materia system in VI, and the story was just not interesting to me in slightest. If anything, I'd be hopeful that the Japanese script might change my mind a bit on the story part of it.

[MrPopo]

My understanding is that Kefka is less enjoyable in the original Japanese version; to the point that the crossover titles have used the American characterization across the board. The thing to remember about the Esper system in FFVI is that it is just as important to pay attention to the stat gains on level ups as it is to focus on getting people spells. And when the characters are combined with relics you actually can replicate most of the various combos of FFV.

[pierrot]

My understanding is that Kefka is less enjoyable in the original Japanese version; to the point that the crossover titles have used the American characterization across the board.

I've never enjoyed Kefka. I don't outright hate him as a character, like Sephiroth, but I do feel painfully ambivalent about him.

I actually did end up starting FF VI. I finished up raiding all of the South Figaro people's stuff, and called it for tonight. I don't remember being able to get a hyper gauntlet, and Hermes' shoes this early, but maybe I just didn't figure out how to get to them until a return trip, or something. Anyway, on the topic of Kefka, I haven't noticed a terribly different demeanor from him (although I don't necessarily remember what his dialog was like in English). He cackles kind of randomly, is bossy, sociopathic, and carries himself with an extreme air of undeserved esteem.

The thing to remember about the Esper system in FFVI is that it is just as important to pay attention to the stat gains on level ups as it is to focus on getting people spells. And when the characters are combined with relics you actually can replicate most of the various combos of FFV.

That's kind of interesting, but it's really an implementation thing for me, more than anything. Set me up on a character growth game board: Coolio, sounds fun. Make me shuffle around a bunch of baubles and trinkets: Eeeh, all right, I'll do it, but I won't be too happy about it.

[marurun]

There were a lot of things I really didn't like about FF VI, and the esper system was one of them. The fact that every character could get almost every spell, that you could give characters whatever stat boosts you wanted... The characters ended up not feeling very well differentiated save their signature ability, which sometimes wasn't that interesting. I'm not against a certain amount of customization in a JRPG, but when that customization has such a homogenizing effect it annoys me.

[pierrot]

Yeah, that's sort of an inhibiting factor for me, too, but for a slightly different reason. With the number of characters, and my general impulses to fill empty spaces, the magic "collecting" can feel a little overwhelming for me. It doesn't help that they don't even come into play until almost halfway through the game.

I got the sense, from what Popes was saying, that mapping out characters' trajectories through certain esper "trees" can actually result in more classed characters. I might think about approaching it this way, at least initially, but I have to say that it does seem a little bit like putting a governor on a Maserati.

[MrPopo]

The esper level ups increase six stats:

HP
MP
Vigor
Stamina
Magic
Speed

HP and MP aren't worth doing unless you want to see 9999/999, as the boost (+20%,+30%,+50%) is to the amount you would have normally gained that level, so characters naturally will get close to caps anyway. Stamina is effectively worthless because the only thing it affects is the amount of periodic ticks (regen, poison damage, sap damage) and it affects them equally. So a high stamina means your regen ticks for more, but also poison ticks for more. So that leaves Vigor, Magic, and Speed. Vigor affects physical attacks, Magic affects magic attacks, and Speed affects your ATB. One problem the game has is that the formulas that use Vigor are linear on Vigor, while formulas that use Magic are quadratic on Magic. So characters you want to set up as your Vigor characters need to go all in on it, while your Magic characters can get a decent number of boosts to hit the damage cap, then dump the rest in Speed.

The magic system does tend to encourage people to skip the characters' unique abilities, because you get this giant toolbox. But the unique abilities, I think, are just as worth using. I'd personally pick to take a character to Magic of Vigor depending on their unique ability, then have the magic be a toolbox for your Magic specced characters and leave it as some utilities (healing, status) for your Vigor characters.

[marurun]

So, that doesn't convince me it's a good system that makes sense in the game, however.

[MrPopo]

I'm not trying to convince you, because it's clear you want something the game doesn't have. I'm also not going to try and convince you that Dark Souls is great if you don't like hard games that punish mistakes.