World is Falling Apart Thread (Locked forever)

[marurun]

So, that Fox story has been rather roundly debunked, eh?

*sigh*

Thing is, Fox's actual news coverage isn't THAT bad. It's just that their opinion content is so heavy-handed and abuts right up onto their news coverage in ways that makes them hard to separate. And sadly MSNBC has adopted the same model.

Welp, sounds like Sweden wasn't so un-prepared for their migrant "invasion" after all.

[Sarge]

Probably a good read, even if you don't like National Review.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/4 ... immigrants

You are correct that Fox News' straight news coverage is pretty good. Their opinion stuff is hit and miss, which I find to be the case... well, pretty much on all the cable networks.

[marurun]

That dovetails well with my earlier post: the immigrants themselves aren't the problem so much as the ability of the nation that takes them to provide them with jobs and a place in society, not just a roof and empty promises. Sweden has done admirably, but they have perhaps bitten off a little more than they can chew. The US, conversely, actually has greater capacity to take in immigrants and asylum-seekers than we have traditionally accepted due to having more low-paying, low-skilled labor jobs (whereas our higher paying labor jobs are the ones that are going away).

[marurun]

Polls polls, everywhere polls. Can't you read the polls?

http://www.npr.org/2017/02/23/516845174 ... rump-maybe

Two different polls, two different results. NPR explores some of the issues involving polling and why two so similar polls may have different results.

[Sarge]

One of my more left-leaning friends posted this on FB, and I thought it was a good (though long) read.

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/arti ... t-century/

[marurun]

It is an interesting read and a lot I agree with, but it has a lot of notable problems that frustrate me:

First, who is inside this bubble of which they speak? I am privileged and well-educated, but I also wrestle with income instability/uncertainty due to the failure of our economy to meet the needs of our workers.

Second, the article does nothing to explain the connection between this and the rise of Trump, though it certainly suggests they are connected. Many of us were surprised at his success because we didn't think anyone was actually foolish enough to think Trump could do anything positive to change any of this, not because we somehow weren't aware of the issues. We already have a lot of very poor and disadvantaged minorities who know what it's like to live with poverty and uncertainty. Those working-class voters who pushed Trump over the edge have never really cared enough about them to do anything to address it, but now that they're in danger of joining them... *sigh*


Thirdly, the opioid epidemic isn't caused by Medicaid. There are a huge number of users, abusers, and sellers who have regular insurance plans as well. While Medicaid has certainly accelerated the scale, the core of the problem lies in a much more complicated set of factors embedded in the daily failings of our medical system writ large.

Fourth, thanks for pointing out that our current laws have resulted in far too many felons with no future. Felons + welfare = problem, but the focus seems to be more on welfare than why we have so many felons to begin with. Welfare isn't the part of this equation that's the problem.

Fifth, welfare dependence is this massive boogie-man to some, but it is so over-stated, here included. The largest number of recipients of welfare are women and children, and most on welfare are working, often multiple jobs. This is more a problem with our economic society at large, not so much welfare itself. And if men are the ones who are most likely to struggle with non-productivity on welfare, is the problem with welfare or something else? The women are working AND taking care of the kids. Why aren't the men doing either? That answer isn't going to be found within welfare itself. It also depends on which welfare program you examine. Tax credits and Medicaid recipients are generally working families. And SNAP recipients cannot get more than 3 months of benefits without working at least 20 hours a week unless there is a waiver program in place (areas where work is simply not available). TANF is probably the one welfare program that does struggle to produce results these days. The only "upside" is that it is temporary. The downside is that it doesn't do much at all to improve work rates or reduce poverty rates, though I'm not sure there's any way a welfare program can reduce poverty. It can only soften the blow until other things change.

[MrPopo]

Very good read. It reminded me of a Cracked article (stay with me) that was written from the perspective of someone who grew up in the stereotypical small town and was written during the election to explain why Trump had so much appeal for that group of people.

In the labor statistics he quoted, I wonder what the breakdown looks like across industries and economic profiles.

[Sarge]

Yeah, I read that Cracked article, too. It was a good one for folks that didn't quite understand why Trump was so successful.

As far as the "bubble", I suspect it's more the intellectual elite that say they care about the "little guy", but have no experience with the way they live and work. I mean, I could be considered part of that because I have an engineering degree, and work at a university as a researcher... but I also grew up in a town of maybe 250 residents, on a small farm, and routinely interact with people like them and the ivory-tower types. I think sometimes it's easier for me to see the disconnect there, because of that. And make no mistake, that disconnect can and does go both ways at times, but the folks in middle America aren't the ones really calling the shots at the top.

[Ack]

In 2010, while desperately looking for work, I signed up and became a Census Taker. What followed was certainly one of the most sobering experiences of my life, going from interviewing some of the richest individuals in the county to the poorest in trailer parks and seeing the disparate natures of their worldview, the way they approached the government, the open appreciation or blatant mistrust that was directed towards me, and occasionally open racism and hostility aimed at either myself or other census takers of varying ethnicity.

I remember in one house being told, "Us white folks gotta stick together," by a lady sitting under a confederate flag. I walked outside to find her daughter playing with the black boy next door whose father was a recently severely burned fire fighter. The man was a hero by all accounts but was in so much pain he could barely handle the interview. I also remember a man of Latin origin pulling a shotgun because he thought I was ICE, interviewing a man in a run-down trailer who'd just lost half his foot to diabetes, and a family of immigrants from India who struggled with their English to tell me how happy they were to live in a small house in America in a half-built neighborhood where the contractor had run out of money before finishing.

I was trained for the census in a small town with three junk shops, one gas station, and a bank built out of a mobile home. A lady in one of those junk shops offered to sell me "filthy porn" while smoking and gasping for breath on her oxygen tank. I expect she's dead by now.

[jp1]

I can say with full confidence that even though I earn a comfortable middle class salary, I'm not now, nor have I ever been, in a "bubble".

I have poor friends and family, routinely work with folks who have to hold multiple jobs to scrape by, and work 65-70 hours regularly myself.

I also work with and for some of the people the article implies are a part of this bubble, and many of them don't fit the stereotype at all.

I've met a few coworkers who are trump supporters, it's almost always because of self interest due to the false promises or sothern bigotry that is still alive and well.

People are baffled that Trump won the election. That isn't a statement that requires an intellectual breakdown of our economy. It's a simple thought, they are baffled because he is possibly if not probably the worse presidential candidate of all time. He says and does stupid shit all the time. Our president has an ongoing beef with Rosie O'donnell, just think on that for a moment. He is an egomaniac with sadistic tendencies and he has the maturity of a preteen. How is anyone not baffled? That's an article worth reading.

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