Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

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isiolia
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by isiolia »

Exhuminator wrote: Phantasy Star Online opened the door to popular and accessible console MMORPGs. Without it to guide the way, the super successful Final Fantasy XI probably wouldn't have existed.
FFXI was already in development when PSO released (started in 1999 AFAIK), and keyed off of Everquest primarily (which the PS2 got as well, in form of Everquest Online Adventures).

While it does get classified as an MMO by some, PSO does largely lack the shared world those have. It's more like Diablo, or other similar games. Still makes it an early effort for online console play, of course.
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by MrPopo »

I'd say Persona 3 is the one to put on the list; it brought the overall SMT moniker to real prominence in the West and got people to notice Atlus.
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Exhuminator
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

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Violent By Design wrote:I'm not sure if I would include the PS2 era Monster Hunter games. I remember MH being met with really poor reception in America and it definitely didn't sell. I'd say it wasn't until the PSP that the Monster Hunter games started to become a JRPG staple(niche in America, but undeniably popular in Japan).
I agree that Monster Hunter didn't get popular until seventh gen PSP. However, this massively popular series got its start with the sixth gen release of Monster Hunter on PS2. Without that key initial release, we wouldn't have seen the series migrate to PSP and become what it is today. So with that frame of reference, the original Monster Hunter is a hallmark release.
Xeogred wrote:Yeah I wouldn't put much stock in Earthbound. It just has a very vocal niche fanbase. Obnoxiously so.
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isiolia wrote:FFXI was already in development when PSO released (started in 1999 AFAIK), and keyed off of Everquest primarily (which the PS2 got as well, in form of Everquest Online Adventures).
Yeah there were multiple console MMORPG concepts in development back then. But PSO beat them all to the punch, and cemented itself as the true originator. PSO released in 2000, two years later FFXI debuted in 2002, and Everquest Online Adventures followed in 2003. While FFXI and EOA were popular, and played in a different vein than PSO, PSO had served as the icebreaker for console MMORPG in general. Thus I consider it a hallmark sixth gen JRPG. (As an aside; EOA never released in Japan unfortunately.)
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Ack
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by Ack »

As a SNES game collector, I will share an interesting truth that I have encountered over the years. If you say you collect SNES games, you will almost always immediately be asked one of two questions: "do you own Earthbound" or "do you own Chrono Trigger". I have told folks that I collect for the SNES for a decade now, and the response has always been for these two games. No Hagane or Dracula X or Aerofighters or Wild Guns. Just Earthbound and Chrono Trigger. Food for thought.

But yes, FF4 deserves to be on the list. I feel our list is also going to be primarily frontloaded in JRPG history.
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by ElkinFencer10 »

I need to get Chrono Trigger. It's one of those games I feel like I'm obligated to own.
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Sarge
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by Sarge »

The DS version has some superfluous content, but it's an excellent way to experience the game without paying through the nose. It's also on mobile devices pretty much everywhere.

I do think it's going to be front-loaded, and I don't think there's any way around that. Traditional JRPGs have definitely been in a slump since the PS2 days, and it also gets hard to estimate which games really have historical significance the more recent they are.

I'm waffling quite a bit on this one, but I think the highest-profile Operation Rainfall game, Xenoblade, might merit inclusion. Even if I like The Last Story more, Xenoblade got more critical acclaim, and had lots of little time-saving innovations and MMORPG-style mechanics in a single-player RPG. It wasn't the first to do the latter, but it probably did it best.

Alternately, we might want to make a cutoff on generations, since we're not clairvoyant or anything. We could reserve predictions for another list. :)
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

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Exhuminator wrote: Yeah there were multiple console MMORPG concepts in development back then. But PSO beat them all to the punch, and cemented itself as the true originator. PSO released in 2000, two years later FFXI debuted in 2002, and Everquest Online Adventures followed in 2003. While FFXI and EOA were popular, and played in a different vein than PSO, PSO had served as the icebreaker for console MMORPG in general. Thus I consider it a hallmark sixth gen JRPG. (As an aside; EOA never released in Japan unfortunately.)
Right, but to say that others "wouldn't have existed" despite being in development prior to PSO launching seems a little...extreme? That's more what I disagree on.

Sixth gen had a push for online play across the board, even if it didn't entirely catch on until seventh gen. Every console either integrated network hardware or had it as an accessory. With online PC games already being quite successful, models or properties from that were being looked at for adaptation.

So, to me, it's a matter of parallel development. Sega picked a model (Diablo's) that worked for their technical requirements, and got it to market first. Which they do deserve credit for - not just for PSO, but the Dreamcast in general. They pushed hard for people to connect their consoles to the internet. PSO stands out not just for console RPGs, but online console games, since I think it was one of the few actually built for that first rather than ported/adapted like Quake III or the like.

At the same time, Sega wasn't exactly going to make PSO for the PS2. :lol: FFXI was a far more ambitious project, bringing a full-fledged Everquest style MMO to a console, albeit reliant on the PS2 HDD accessory to do it. It's not just one of (if not the) first actual MMOs for a console, but the one with continued success - it was the last supported PS2 game until earlier this year, when SE discontinued console support for the game.
It also did a number of other things somewhat uniquely - few other MMOs have combined their playerbase to the same level (all players on the same servers, regardless of region or platform), and skewed things more towards JRPG-ness with more of a focus on PVE and story than other MMOs of the time.

To a fair point, it'd be a worthy mention as well.
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Exhuminator
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by Exhuminator »

isiolia wrote:Right, but to say that others "wouldn't have existed" despite being in development prior to PSO launching seems a little...extreme?
Okay, fair enough. More what I meant was; "wouldn't have been accepted as quickly and openly if PSO hadn't warmed up the welcome mat first".
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by BoneSnapDeez »

There is absolutely no reason Final Fantasy XI should be in this discussion. PSO I can get behind.
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Re: Historical hallmarks of the JRPG genre

Post by Sarge »

I was thinking along similar lines. By your own admission, it's an Everquest-styled affair, which is a very Western take on the RPG. Not to diminish its importance or anything as far as console RPGs in general (very much impressive in terms of scope and ambition), but it's just not quite in that JRPG category.

(It's also why we're not including Etrian Odyssey, which has roots in Wizardry.)
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