The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Level up here
User avatar
pierrot
Next-Gen
Posts: 4196
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:54 am
Location: Banned

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by pierrot »

Xeogred wrote:
pierrot wrote:I would surely hate to be a person who is unable to acknowledge how much better Cross is than Trigger.
I'm not challenging you here, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on Cross. I was a big fan of it growing up, but once the internet hit that never seemed to be anyone else experience and years later it's still the same case.
Better cast of characters, for one thing. I can understand not liking Leena, or the size of the cast, but Tsukuyomi/Harle trounces on almost every other character in a Square game. I think there's more character in the cast, as a whole, and the silly/irreverent characters are less prominently featured. As for Trigger's cast, I think it's a joke. I thought Magus was cool when I was a pre-teen, and Lucca is all right (although I don't like her design much) but I have never hated a silent protagonist more than that bum, Chrono. (He isn't silent, but Randy came really close.) Schala might be the only CT character I care about, which is fitting because 12K BC is the only time period in the game that I actually like. Every other period makes me feel the irritation of playing through them, just in thinking about it. (Even 12K BC has some shitty spots, though.)

Cross has more meaningful antagonists. I much prefer the world of Chrono Cross. Artistically speaking, Trigger can almost hold its own with Cross (perhaps I would agree that Trigger has held up a bit better graphically) but the music and art design in Cross are simply superlative.

Where it stops even being a competition is in combat. Cross has so much more going for it, in its battle system. Its mechanics are much more complicated, that's for sure, but getting a handle on the nuances of it is very rewarding. The different attack levels have corresponding hit ratios that are boosted with successive hits, giving more weight to the decision of what attack level to choose. Even more so because it boosts a character's element level, in battle, but one still has to consider stamina. At max stamina, one could choose to do two level-1 attacks, a level-2, and then a level-3 attack (the safest combination, in terms of hit percentage) followed by a level-7 element, which would surely do a bunch of damage, but then leave the character at a disadvantage because he's now sitting at approximately (negative)6.0 stamina. Oh, but wait, what happens if in this carefully planned string of attacks, one of the level-1 attacks misses? Well, the player might have to adjust his combat strategy. This isn't even mentioning the element color field. By comparison, what happens in Chrono Trigger: wait for an ATB bar to fill up, and select "attack"; maybe throw out a combo tech. Woo--. How will I ever contain my excitement--.

I enjoy Satchel's thoughts on Chrono Cross. Perhaps others will, too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iall_4SJkTQ
Betagam7 wrote:Unlike some of the people claiming it should be ditched for a game they've only heard about (Terranigma), I've played all 3 of the Blazer trilogy to completion and, while Illusion of Time (as I knew it) was by the far the most linear it also had the richest, most imaginative and genuinely moving storyline of any game I played in the 16 bit era.
I have also played all three--only last year, even. While Soul Blazer and Terranigma were both great, Gaia was easily the worst of the bunch. It certainly wasn't good, in my opinion, but I've been over that before, rather recently.
_____________________________________
Steam (and other) keys for trade/free: viewtopic.php?p=1189267#p1189267

B/S/T Thread: viewtopic.php?p=1188724#p1188724
User avatar
marurun
Moderator
Posts: 12406
Joined: Sat May 06, 2006 8:51 am
Location: Cleveland, OH
Contact:

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by marurun »

You opened the door. You don't get to be the only person with an opinion on the subject.
User avatar
Exhuminator
Next-Gen
Posts: 11573
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:24 am
Contact:

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Exhuminator »

Fair enough. (But keep in mind I didn't "open the door" on debating whether the Quintet SNES games were actually RPGs or not. Others were arguing that aspect before I made my response.)
marurun wrote:I am of the opinion that if the primary mode of gameplay is action-driven direct character control, it doesn't quality as an RPG, but as an ARPG at best, and ARPGs are not RPGs. They are their own thing, and they deserve their own must play list because they do cool things RPGs do not.
So I say the quintent trilogy are RPGs. Meaning you gain levels by killing enemies, you explore towns and talk to NPCs, you acquire better equipment to raise your stats, your adventure takes you through a long and involved plot, and you ultimately save the planet each time by fighting a big bad guy. Those are enough standard JRPG tropes for me. Now yes these are action games too. Action-RPGs made by Japanese developers, yes. Meaning these are Japanese games of a specific genre... action-RPG, thus they are action-JRPGs. So when I'm looking at a list of must play JRPGs (an umbrella term in my book) then these games are eligible contenders.
PLAY KING'S FIELD.
User avatar
BoneSnapDeez
Next-Gen
Posts: 20148
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 1:08 pm
Location: Maine

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by BoneSnapDeez »

"JRPG" really has two meanings.

It can refer to any role-playing game whose country of origin is Japan regardless of specific mechanical style. Thus, by this metric, games as varied as Ys, Lunar, Shining Force, Fatal Labyrinth, and Deep Dungeon are all JRPGs.

The second definition refers to a genre - games of specific style that originated in Japan and continues to be popular there. "Games like Dragon Quest" essentially. It's more accurate to call these games "Japanese-Style" RPGs, as GameFAQs calls them, as we have seen an influx of these developed in the West (as well as China, Korea, and elsewhere) especially since the advent of the indie gaming boom and the proliferation of game-maker software.

The author of the piece Ack linked was simply operating under the first definition - any RPGs that came outta Japan were eligible.

And action-RPGs are most certainly a subset of the larger world of RPGs.
User avatar
Xeogred
Next-Gen
Posts: 14387
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:49 pm
Location: KC

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Xeogred »

^ the funny thing is that some Japanese developers hate the term "JRPG" and wish they were just referred to RPG's. I think Tetsuya Takahashi maybe said that and it wasn't the first time I've heard someone from over there seem baffled by the label. I can see why they'd argue that, but personally I do think it's a decent way to split up the genre.

pierrot - nice read. I'll check out that video, maybe I've seen it. Now you've made me want to jump back into my last file of Cross and finish it up. I remember liking the second half a lot more when you switch bodies and then start diving into the ancient past with the sci-fi stuff, and the Frozen Flame thing gets super weird. I agree on Schala being a highlight of both games. To be frank though, maybe this is why I don't seem to hold Trigger in as high regard as the masses, I don't find any of the characters in either game to be that great. To me I find it more fascinating and interesting that from what I've known over the years, a lot of the staff behind the Chrono games (the "Dream Team") ended up basically being the team behind Xenogears, and more than likely are what makes up Monolith-Soft today. Although Tetsuya Takahashi has his extremely strong hand in the Xenogears/Xenosaga games, I think there's a lot of comparisons that can be made with them and Chrono in how the games progress, and even down to the dialogue, weird experimental battle systems per game, etc. It's something I can never precisely describe, but to me it just makes a lot of sense a lot of staff probably crossed over between them. Maybe it's just me in the end though.

Don't get me wrong fellas, I still freaking love Chrono Trigger and it hits that sci-fi itch a lot of other games of its style don't hit. But when it comes down to what most seem to see as the big two for the SNES, I'd say FF6 is way better. And you guys see how much I love some FF's just as much as FF6, so I'm probably a bigger FF fan in general. FF4, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, and Seiken Densetsu 3 are probably the main JRPG's I've replayed the most on the SNES. With FF4 climbing the ranks over the years (with its various versions and ports, I loved the PSP one).
Image
HLTB | PSN Trophies | RFG (WIP)
User avatar
marurun
Moderator
Posts: 12406
Joined: Sat May 06, 2006 8:51 am
Location: Cleveland, OH
Contact:

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by marurun »

I think I prefer more narrow genre or game style definitions, just because when evaluating options for limited spots for stuff like this there is a lot of apples to oranges. So easy to get lost in the weeds. Besides, there are tons of great ARPGs on PSX and Saturn we have completely not touched on that deserve a spot.
User avatar
Jmustang1968
Next-Gen
Posts: 6530
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:51 pm
Location: Houston, TX

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Jmustang1968 »

I still think JRPG is appropriate for the ARPG and SRPG distinctions.

A western developed ARPG has a different style than a Japanese ARPG. Examples would be TES games, and the Witcher series, and JRPG games such as Ys, Secret of Mana, and Tales series.

Then for SRPGs you have things like FFT, Tactics Ogre for the Japanese, and then games like Wasteland 2, Banner Saga, Pillars of Eternity for Western.
Last edited by Jmustang1968 on Sun Jul 17, 2016 7:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Xeogred
Next-Gen
Posts: 14387
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:49 pm
Location: KC

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Xeogred »

It goes to show how biased I am, because every Western game you mentioned there I'd just call an RPG or WRPG, lol. It's JRPG's I like to separate more, because I like them more for the most part, so I'm more interested in breaking them down and such I guess.
Image
HLTB | PSN Trophies | RFG (WIP)
User avatar
Sarge
Next-Gen
Posts: 7273
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:08 pm

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Sarge »

Definitely an interesting read, pierrot. And I disagree with almost all of it. ;) There's a reason that I've replayed Trigger many times, and always bogged down in replays of Cross. However, I will acknowledge that Cross is a good, perhaps even excellent game, but as a CT sequel it's absolutely terrible. I almost wish they hadn't tried to tie it into the series and made it a standalone game. It's very nearly that as it is, with a few spits in the face to CT fans plot-wise.

I enjoy the gameplay and exploration a lot more, and the game is just complex enough to be interesting without getting crazy esoteric. It's very much got Dragon Quest sensibilities, with a SquareSoft vibe.

And I like the characters. I can barely keep most of them straight in Cross. Most of them have no depth at all. Not that Trigger does, but Cross would have benefited from a reduced cast.

Yeah, I'm ragging on it quite a bit, but again, I quite liked the game when I played through it. It's a cut above all the PSX FF games, in my mind. But it definitely doesn't dethrone Chrono Trigger in my book.
User avatar
Exhuminator
Next-Gen
Posts: 11573
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:24 am
Contact:

Re: The Only 26 JRPGs You Absolutely Have to Play

Post by Exhuminator »

All I can say is I've beaten Chrono Trigger and I've beaten Chrono Cross, and Chrono Trigger was the better game for my enjoyment. That's not to say Cross is without merit, it is a quality JRPG in its own right. But better than Trigger? Not in my book.
PLAY KING'S FIELD.
Post Reply