The Super Mario Maker Thread

NES, SNES, N64, Gamecube, Wii
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BogusMeatFactory
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

Post by BogusMeatFactory »

Blu wrote:Can we just have a vent session really quick? I think Nintendo needs to implement some criteria or help us clearly understand what justifies a level showing up in the 100-Mario Expert Mode.

There's so many levels that come up for me that I believe were beaten once and never again. I get frustrated seeing good level design flying in the face of let's make something that is challenging and also unforgiving.

"You will DIE" is not an encouraging level and usually results in a skip right as I get a sense of what the level entails. I must have skipped over 50 courses, and lost 65 of my 100 lives and only cleared a total of 4 stages.

I think Nintendo needs to be a little more choosy about what gets through, that's all. I haven't yet beaten 100-Mario Expert yet, but for any of those that have, am I off base here? It seems to be flooded with tons of levels that are utmost difficult, luck is required, and absolute precision.

Yeah I anticipated the issues with Hard mode. That is why the included 100 lives, but again one of the major flaws in game design is that the player must interpret what the game designer built. You can make a game seem impossible, only to intend the player to take an alternate route by making a pinpoint accurate jump off of a wall to get to an obstacle-less area. No one will know that that is the case, because they simply see an obstacle they are meant to overcome.

I feel like the Mario shadow effect in the development tools is the most abused tool for those types of levels. They make mario do a series of jumps and actions and then build obstacles around that, seeing that if you jump at a certain point in the level at full speed, you will be able to move through a certain obstacle. The problem is that the player can't do it unless they replicate that EXACT action. I understand why the frame by frame effect for Mario was implemented, but I feel like it is the best way to make impossible levels for players.
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

Post by BogusMeatFactory »

Hate to double post, but I wanted to share the two new levels I just uploaded. One is very experimental and I hope it worked out correctly. It looks right from my perspective, but I would like to see if everyone is experiencing it the same as I am.

The level is called Who Wants to be a Marionaire!? (E159-0000-005E-D12B)

It is a quiz game show using the in-game comments to offer questions and answer choices for the players. Let me know how it worked for you guys and fingers crossed that it stays that it goes well!

The second level is Mushroom Man (39E4-0000-005E-BECD)

This level is an homage to Mega Man, with lots of platforming, enemies and a very underwhelming boss! I mean....it is Mushroom Man, so what do you expect!? Enjoy!
Ack wrote:I don't know, chief, the haunting feeling of lust I feel whenever I look at your avatar makes me think it's real.
-I am the idiot that likes to have fun and be happy.
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Ziggy
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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Like I said earlier, I kinda wish the level lengths could be a little longer. I really wanted to remake some SMW levels, but they're too long. I went ahead and made "Yoshi's Island 2" remix anyway, I just had to shorten up some parts (that's why it's "remixed"). That level is kinda boring, in perspective, but I've got a soft spot for it. There's no dragon coins, so I put some 1-ups in there. There's also no Chargin' Chucks, and you can't put moles in semi-solid platforms, et cetera, but whatever.

SMW 'Yoshi's Island 2' REMIX

1E45-0000-005F-6BFA





Bogus, I'll play your levels tomorrow!

Man, life really got in the way of me playing Mario Maker this weekend. Don't you hate it when that happens? I know there's still a few levels posted in this thread that I haven't tried yet. I gotta fix that.
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alienjesus
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

Post by alienjesus »

How many different themes can you include in one level? Is it just 2?
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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alienjesus wrote:How many different themes can you include in one level? Is it just 2?
(NOTE: CAPSLOCK IS TURNED ON IN HONOR OF OUR SPECIAL BIRTHDAY BOYS)

YES SADLY! YOU CAN HAVE ONE THEME FOR THE MAIN LEVEL AND ONE SEPARATE THEME FOR WORLDS THROUGH THE WARP PIPE!

ALSO! I GOT PATRICIA HERNANDEZ OF KOTAKU TO STAR MY LEVEL, WHO WANTS TO BE A MARIONAIRE!? SO IF YOU WANT TO SEE SOME VERY STRANGE AND UNORTHODOX LEVELS, JUST CHECK OUT WHAT SHE HAS STARRED. CLICK ON THE FLAG/STAR ICON ON THAT LEVEL IN PARTICULAR AND YOU WILL SEE A MII NAMED PATTY. TOUCH HER MII AND THEN LOOK AT WHAT SHE HAS STARRED. THERE ARE SOME REALLY REALLY STRANGE LEVELS INCLUDED A DATING SIM AND A CHOOSE YOUR OWN ADVENTURE. WEIRD!
Ack wrote:I don't know, chief, the haunting feeling of lust I feel whenever I look at your avatar makes me think it's real.
-I am the idiot that likes to have fun and be happy.
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Ziggy
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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BogusMeatFactory wrote:Yeah I anticipated the issues with Hard mode. That is why the included 100 lives, but again one of the major flaws in game design is that the player must interpret what the game designer built. You can make a game seem impossible, only to intend the player to take an alternate route by making a pinpoint accurate jump off of a wall to get to an obstacle-less area. No one will know that that is the case, because they simply see an obstacle they are meant to overcome.

I feel like the Mario shadow effect in the development tools is the most abused tool for those types of levels. They make mario do a series of jumps and actions and then build obstacles around that, seeing that if you jump at a certain point in the level at full speed, you will be able to move through a certain obstacle. The problem is that the player can't do it unless they replicate that EXACT action. I understand why the frame by frame effect for Mario was implemented, but I feel like it is the best way to make impossible levels for players.
Those people are just no good at making levels then. I watched a video on YouTube of Miyamoto playing Mario Maker. He said (I'm paraphrasing) that when he was designing levels for SMB1, he'd have one thing in mind that seemed obvious but then a play tester would do (or try and do) something he didn't even think of. Point is, you can't just assume every one is gonna see your level the same way you do. I know not every one has people that can play test your levels before uploading it, so you really gotta play test the hell out of it yourself and try to "break" it. You know you intended for the player to go THAT way, but you have to think, "What if they try to go THIS way?" You have to play your level over and over with that mindset. Sometimes you have to make minor tweaks, sometimes you have to completely redraw an entire section of level.

The Mario shadow tool is great, obviously, but if you're gonna use it for pinpoint moves then you have to clue the player into that. Use coins as hints. Either place a single coin in the jumping/landing positions, or trail coins to show where the jump should be, stuff like that.

Even after you upload a level, there's still room for improvement. When you go into Course World and view your uploaded levels, when you click on a particular level you can see red X's where people died. You can use that to better understand what people see that you're not seeing, and possibly use it to improve your level. You might see a bunch of X's at a spot that you thought was obvious to get past, but the X's say it isn't! I used this to improve my Spin Jump Hard and Insane levels, and reuploaded updated versions of both. I used it a LOT with my Underground Fun level, and it lead to me making a MUCH better version of the level, I think.
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BogusMeatFactory
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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I AGREE 100% ZIGGY! THESE TOOLS ARE BUILT IN THERE TO HELP YOU DEVELOP YOUR LEVELS BETTER AND THEY ARE TOOLS THAT I OBSESS OVER CONSTANTLY!

ALSO, MY GRASSROOTS CAMPAIGN IS PAYING OFF. BY PLAYING AND COMMENTING PEOPLE'S LEVELS IN MASS, THEY ARE MORE INCLINED TO PLAY A HANDFUL OF MY LEVELS AND STAR THEM AS WELL. I AM GOING TO SAY THAT THIS IS A GOOD METHOD, BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE INSANELY STINGY ON THE STARS!
Ack wrote:I don't know, chief, the haunting feeling of lust I feel whenever I look at your avatar makes me think it's real.
-I am the idiot that likes to have fun and be happy.
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Ziggy
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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People ARE really stingy on stars, I've noticed.
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Michi
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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Ziggy587 wrote:People ARE really stingy on stars, I've noticed.
I've noticed that too.

But don't blame me. I've starred everything I've beaten so far. Even the ones that probably don't deserve it. I am the Oprah of giving out stars. "And you get a star! And you get a star! Stars for everybody!"
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Re: The Super Mario Maker Thread

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Michi wrote:
Ziggy587 wrote:People ARE really stingy on stars, I've noticed.
I've noticed that too.

But don't blame me. I've starred everything I've beaten so far. Even the ones that probably don't deserve it. I am the Oprah of giving out stars. "And you get a star! And you get a star! Stars for everybody!"
I COULD NEVER BLAME YOU! YOU ARE AN ABSOLUTE GEM. A NATIONAL TREASURE.

ALSO, HAPPY BIRTHDAY REPRISE. FOR YOUR BIRTHDAY, YOU GET.... YOUR THIRD MEDAL! CONGRATULATIONS ON HITTING OVER 150 STARS!

ZIGGY YOU ARE SO CLOSE TOO! KEEP IT UP YOU ARE DOING GREAT!
Ack wrote:I don't know, chief, the haunting feeling of lust I feel whenever I look at your avatar makes me think it's real.
-I am the idiot that likes to have fun and be happy.
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