SNES Vertical Line Discussion

[Zing]

I just tested Final Fantasy III. You can see the dark line right from powering up. Even though there is no horizontal movement, it is very clear as the screen pans down and shows the title screen.

[Ziggy]

Is anyone who is getting this line using an LCD or Plasma TV?

As I said a post or two ago, I was able to get this vertical line on my HDTV, which is an LCD. However, as I said, I was only able to get it when I turned the brightness all the way down to zero. And I only saw it in Earthbound during the night (it's completely not there during the day) which is in direct contrast to Zing's experience of seeing it during the day.

[Redifer]

Blaming the TV doesn't explain why there is absolutely no such image problem with the NES or PS1 via composite. "Moire" seems isn't something you have a problem with on any TV. It would signify that the sharpness level is too high or VM is enabled.

I really don't want to prattle on about myself, but please consider that I work with video professionally. It's my job. It's been my job for a loooong time. Moire is not simply a matter of sharpness, that's ridiculous. I am quickly coming to the conclusion that you really don't know much of what you are talking about.

As far as not being able to explain why the bar wouldn't show up on NES games if the TV were to blame (which actually is a fair question), it should be explained that not all video signals are equal. For example, if I try to capture video from my SNES into a certain DV converter, it works fine. I try to capture video from my Genesis the same exact way into the same exact machine, it spazzes out the colors and makes them way too bright. Or if I try to record an arcade game it will sometimes cause breakup (I have a thread about this in the OTHER CONSOLES forum where it was happening with the MVS). Miniscule timings that we can't see can cause certain equipment to behave erratically. The TV being the issue is only a theory right now as obviously the official cause has not been discovered. But I still fall back on my initial thought... a cap (or maybe a few) in the SNES that can't quite hold its charge as well as it used to. Or maybe a resistor that isn't resisting as much (because that would be futile) but that seems unlikely.

[Zing]

For what it's worth, here is another thread, with a couple people claiming they noticed the vertical lines back in the SNES era:
http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=152622

It is also confirmed there, via reports from owners who verified their internals, that pretty much every PCB and encoder revision can show the line.

Between the three threads, we see that this problem can occur regardless of television, PCB, encoder, or age.

I don't feel so annoyed now, but I would like to know what the !#$@# causes this!

[Jamisonia]

I looked into what I thought was another cap. Turns out its actually a crystal thats connected to the S-APU, the sound chip. It have tested the caps on my mini, and all but one was reading correctly. The one that wasn't right, wasn't that far off, but I replaced it anyway. It made no difference.

I did stumble upon a website claiming to have SNES schematics:
http://www.caitsith2.net/snes/index.htm

From a cursory glance they appear to be correct. I think I might try the unthinkable next: contacting Nintendo.

[Redifer]

OK it looks like Zing may be correct that this affects all models. I looked closely on mine in the opening stage of Super Metroid and I can see an ever-so-slight discoloring where other people have a stripe. My system is connected via RGB. But I have other questions (that have nobody yet has the answers to):

-Why do some people have a bright line and others a darker line?
-Why do I have a discolored line that I have to strain my eyeballs to see?
-Why would some games show it and others don't?

I don't think NIntendo will be of much help, but good luck.

[Jamisonia]

I'm sure they won't but it won't hurt to ask.

Your questions are thus far unanswerable. I can tell you that I currently have 2 minis and 1 original (later revision SNES). The Original SNES is by the far the worst. Then I have one Mini that is less noticeable, then I have a Mini I just got from eBay last week, and its barely there. You have to strain your eye to see it. This is all tested on my Samsung Plasma Model# PN42C450B1D using composite.

I can also see these line on my original SNES using a Toshiba CRT Model# 32AF43 using s-video. I do not have the capability of testing RF as the mini does not have RF and I have modified by original SNES to output s/pdif which forced me to give the RF RCA jack a new purpose.

[Jamisonia]

Contacted Nintendo, so we'll see.

[Redifer]

Be patient. They usually take a couple of days to respond. I wrote them asking why the HOME screens on the Wii and 3DS were such clusterfucks and could not be organized into folders. A few days later they sent me back a peachy response saying that they'd pass on my comments. Helpful!

[Jamisonia]

Well I would say the longer it takes the better. I told them I would be patient I was really hoping somebody would dig for me. I'm just hoping somewhere in the annals of Nintendo they are aware of this problem and have some info on at least whats causing it. Now A. whether this is easily found, and B. whether if found they would just give it to me is a different story. Although I really believe A. is the biggest hurdle. I think as long as it doesn't involving giving up secrets or schematics they might give me their info if they find it.