Game collecting is not what it once was

[dogman91]

I also say this, not because I'm a hardcore player or part of some supposed elite, but because I don't think that credit feeding is conductive to a good, meaningful experience of the games. It's not some kind of oddity, either, I also think that grinding levels breaks Fire Emblem and that aut-aim ruins first person shooters for similar reasons.

I have no idea why infinite arenas are a thing... I saw absolutely no reason not to grind my characters in there if I had the opportunity. Breaks the game IMO.

BTW about 1CC: what do the hardcores think the general criteria is on 1CC'ing something? Does everything HAVE to be the minimum amount of lives and health? This also including stuff like platformers (Ghosts n' Goblins, Magician Lord...)

[MrPopo]

I also say this, not because I'm a hardcore player or part of some supposed elite, but because I don't think that credit feeding is conductive to a good, meaningful experience of the games. It's not some kind of oddity, either, I also think that grinding levels breaks Fire Emblem and that aut-aim ruins first person shooters for similar reasons.

I have no idea why infinite arenas are a thing... I saw absolutely no reason not to grind my characters in there if I had the opportunity. Breaks the game IMO.

BTW about 1CC: what do the hardcores think the general criteria is on 1CC'ing something? Does everything HAVE to be the minimum amount of lives and health? This also including stuff like platformers (Ghosts n' Goblins, Magician Lord...)

You're talking about games that let you set number of lives per credit in the options? My understanding is going by the defaults is considered a proper 1cc.

[alienjesus]

You got a soccer ball for your birthday. I come over and want to play soccer - you'd rather just throw it back and forth. So, we play some catch, and I say, "Brother - listen, if we get a net, and some chalk, i'll make a pitch and we can play a game." You say, "Naw, I just wanna play catch with it, i'm having fun, I enjoy this." I say, "Ok, yeah, this is fun, but seriously, there is a really cool thing to do with this, if we use our feet, and then there is some sort of indepth deeper enjoyment we can have with it, let me show you, it's awesome!." You, "naw, you're taking the fun away. I just want to catch it. I'll go somewhere else where people don't talk about kicking it."



Truly. I am sorry if we are turning people away from shooters, because they are such an amazing and deep genre and I wish I could articulate that better

See, if we're going for bad analogies based around presents, how I see this is that it's like if I'd gotten a Lego Set for my Birthday. It's a really awesome lego set, it makes a castle with a drawbridge, and pit fall traps and everything. It's pretty awesome.

You and me both built the castle following the instructions, and we played with it, and we had a blast. Like I said, it's a pretty fucking sweet castle.

Afterwards though, I decided I'd rather use the Lego kit to build something else - like, I dunno, a giant robot. Those are pretty sweet too y'see. They're pretty different to trap filled castles, but they're still cool. Anyhow, you then get upset - 'but that's not what this was built for, it was designed to be an awesome castle! You're playing with it wrong!' And I'm like 'it might have been designed to be a castle, but you can still have fun using it this way, and anyway, I like giant robots better!' And then you laugh about how silly it is that someone would consider themselves as having beaten a lego set if they hadn't 1CC'd it and this whole analogy falls apart because it's frankly a bit shit.

Anyhow, I definitely respect the passion you guys have for the genre, and I understand that you want to see people experience it properly. But just because something was DESIGNED to be played a certain way, it doesn't mean there's necessarily a single correct way to play it. And I find that telling people that their way is the wrong way is very much the equivalent of a kid going 'stop it, you're doing it wrong!'

[Erik_Twice]

I have no idea why infinite arenas are a thing... I saw absolutely no reason not to grind my characters in there if I had the opportunity. Breaks the game IMO.

I agree. They are free level-ups you can use over and over and even if you can only gain a couple extra levels per chapter, like in Genealogy, they invariable ruin any semblance of balance the game has.

They are included to prevent unwinnable situations and to allow characters that fell behind to come back to the forefront, which makes sense, but there are better ways to do that than allowing the player to get as many free level-ups as he wants. :/

BTW about 1CC: what do the hardcores think the general criteria is on 1CC'ing something? Does everything HAVE to be the minimum amount of lives and health? This also including stuff like platformers (Ghosts n' Goblins, Magician Lord...)

Nah, default is fine.

And I find that telling people that their way is the wrong way is very much the equivalent of a kid going 'stop it, you're doing it wrong!'

I simply think that some ways of playing a game are significantly less interesting and more counterproductive to the game's goals than others. No more, no less.

[BoneSnapDeez]

The idea that developers "want" people to play their games one way and one way only is a bit silly. Developers cater to multiple audiences which is why you are given an option to continue in arcade games or level-grind in RPGs. To insist one way is "right" and the other is "wrong" makes little sense. It's a matter if preference.

Again, we are passionate and only want others to understand and possibly experience the joy from these genres (run n' gun, shmup) that we have.

The problem is that the way you shmup lovin' guys are coming across is doing nothing but making me feel less inclined to play these games. It's basically saying we should enjoy them in exactly the same way you guys do, which isn't fair at all. You're all coming across as elitist and judgemental.

I don't feel less inclined to play these games. But less inclined to post: yes indeed. I love shmups old and new. I even like the Cave game enough to import certain titles that didn't hit the States. I've hitten a few arcade shmup 1CC's this year. But I'm perfectly content to discuss these games within the confines of, say, the Games Beaten thread where the overall environment seems more casual and less judgmental.

[Erik_Twice]

C'mon guys nobody is shaming you into playing games a certain way. You might not agree with us, but the accussations of elitism and of being one of those "stop having fun guys" are disproportionate and kind of grating, specially when posters have written long posts explaining their position in a polite manner.

[BoneSnapDeez]

Nah, no one is "shaming" me or causing me to change gaming habits.

The issue is that, regardless of intent, many of the posts by the 1CC-or-bust crowd are coming across less like "hey I play games differently than you, lemma tell ya how I do it" and more like "you're doing it wrong."

Anyhow, I feel like we're just going in circles at this point and have nothing much else to say about this topic.

[dsheinem]

"hey I play games differently than you, lemma tell ya how I do it" and more like "you're doing it wrong."

You don't think there can be a wrong way to properly play a game?

[Ack]

"hey I play games differently than you, lemma tell ya how I do it" and more like "you're doing it wrong."

You don't think there can be a wrong way to properly play a game?

If you wore pants while playing the game, you did it wrong.

[Gunstar Green]

"hey I play games differently than you, lemma tell ya how I do it" and more like "you're doing it wrong."

You don't think there can be a wrong way to properly play a game?

If you wore pants while playing the game, you did it wrong.

I finally understand soccer!