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Does anyone that has used an Android phone have experience with NESoid and SNESoid? If so what did you think?

aaron wrote:android is open dev, why don't you write a better phone app then?

or use voice dialing in your big rig?

wtf? i have never had a problem making calls while doing something else. it's really not hard, at all, there is just a learning curve. i feel like this is akin to the old guy in the office who just can't figure out how to get his infernal web machine to go back to "the internet."

And you sound like the 'though shall not bash my favourite toy' kid who can not admit that what there is, is kind of shit.

Phones should not require a "learning curve". This is akin to the Mac debate, Mac should not require a learning curve if it wasn't to be called 'intuitive'. Nor should these 'smart phones'... they aren't so smart if I have to "write a better fucking phone app"... are you kidding me? Really are you kidding me!? At the price these phones cost, I should not have to make my own... and only a very few number of smart phones are open source to allow you to do this.

And voice dial, ummm, business people don't have every number logged in their phone. They call new people every day. I don't drive truck myself (my entire family does and I did at a time), but both in their job, AND my job (programmer), we have to call new people whom we just received the number of. Let alone the fact half these numbers are not numbers we'd want sitting in our phone directories as they aren't that necessary to have stored... how crap would it be dealing with a directory of 400+ numbers... easy. My father would get at least 100 new numbers a MONTH.

Now when it comes to this dialing...

touch pads (i.e. iPhone or PPC####) - HA crap, garbage, if you can't admit this shit... I don't know... I can't even begin to comprehend anyone not understanding why a non-tactile input device for phone numbers is bad.

large full keypads with the numbers placed amidst it (i.e. blackberry's) - who's going to memorize all those different keys. The tactile funciton of the entire thing is lost yet again. It's not like a keyboard where you get 10 fingers, it's one thumb for all those keys... and then each key serves multiple purposes, sometimes 3 or 4 'fn's.

stylus assisted dialing (i.e. PPC####) - really now I need a tool to dial (if no one has seen these, they haven't been well introduced to the smart phone market)

voice dialing (i.e. nearly all cell phones) - the phone already has to have the number stored in its database, not very good for new numbers. Furthermore the voice recognition is kind of crap, especially if there is noise disturbance around (i.e. while working!)

touch scroll (i.e. iPhone) - here's another I have an issue with. The touch screen and different sized fingers come into some weird tactile mishaps... every person I know (yes that's an I, you may not, but I've spent quite a bit of time in the business world) has had many complaints about these features accidently selecting the wrong person, or freezing up mid scroll in very long lists.


Tell me everyone, do you often look at your phone when dialing? I don't. I know where my fingers are in comparison to the keys. There is 12 of them, it's relatively easy to know where you are. It's a kin to typing on a keyboard with out looking. This are time honoured design practices that get people jumping on band wagons.

There is a new one though as well... a new design practice... and that is "we'll blow em' out of the water with gimmicks so that they'll be to busy sucking our dicks to complain about what we really screwed up."



Don't get me wrong here. I've already said. I love a lot of the new functionality smart phones, portable pcs, and PDAs bring to the scene. The different apps and the sort are outright stellar. But it's a phone first and foremost... or atleast it's trying to be a phone replacement. So in doing such, they should be pushing the phone side up to normal standards... not just pushing it out of the way. They will be losing many a customer that way... it's just poor design. And I'm not alone in this, I know I'm not. I just happen to be in this crowd of guys who love that they can play their retro consoles on the thing. That's awesome... but I have 30 other devices that do that. But I need a damn phone for fuck sake!

A Thumb and a Pinkie

Nothing exciting, a motorola rizr z3...I only make calls from my phone. Retro old school style.

Jrecee wrote:

Awesome.

I have a very beat-up Motorola V265 cell phone that I've had for about 4 1/2 years (since I started college), with half the paint rubbed off, and scratches and dents from being dropped over fifty thousand times, and a very loose back part that probably holds the battery. The battery can only keep a charge for a little over a day, and the signal drops out every now and then. Sometimes I have trouble calling home with it...

I really should get a new phone, but I haven't really gotten around to it. Probably the day when it just refuses to turn on.

If I got a new phone, I'd want a blue Motorola RAZR V3. Even though it's an older model, I think it looks cool!

christ...

lordofduct wrote:And you sound like the 'though shall not bash my favourite toy' kid who can not admit that what there is, is kind of shit.

no, i was just looking for legitimate arguments. which i will tackle henceforth...

lordofduct wrote:Phones should not require a "learning curve". This is akin to the Mac debate, Mac should not require a learning curve if it wasn't to be called 'intuitive'. Nor should these 'smart phones'... they aren't so smart if I have to "write a better fucking phone app"... are you kidding me? Really are you kidding me!? At the price these phones cost, I should not have to make my own... and only a very few number of smart phones are open source to allow you to do this.

i didn't curse at you so don't misquote me, thanks. this is a completely silly argument to me. every "new-to-you" device requires a learning curve. there's a learning curve to driving a car (or a new kind of car), there is a learning curve to the alphabet for a 2 year old, and to keep things topical for this forum there is a learning curve to picking up a new style of video game/controller (steel battalion, virtual on, whatever). the reason people take the time to adapt to these things is because they want a better (or at least different) experience. my phone is awesome now that i am used to it. it took a while, but now that i have it mastered i can dial with my fingers without looking, use voice dialing, all of the big, scary features you're complaining about are easy to me because i took the time to learn how to utilize them properly and efficiently.

lordofduct wrote:And voice dial, ummm, business people don't have every number logged in their phone. They call new people every day. I don't drive truck myself (my entire family does and I did at a time), but both in their job, AND my job (programmer), we have to call new people whom we just received the number of. Let alone the fact half these numbers are not numbers we'd want sitting in our phone directories as they aren't that necessary to have stored... how crap would it be dealing with a directory of 400+ numbers... easy. My father would get at least 100 new numbers a MONTH.

if a touch-screen smartphone is not easily applicable to your specific work environment, then that's fine, don't use one. but don't tell me that anything other than what you're using is worthless simply because you won't take the time to even try it for a substantial period of time.

lordofduct wrote:Now when it comes to this dialing...

now, indeed.

lordofduct wrote:touch pads (i.e. iPhone or PPC####) - HA crap, garbage, if you can't admit this shit... I don't know... I can't even begin to comprehend anyone not understanding why a non-tactile input device for phone numbers is bad.

again, you sound like someone completely afraid of adapting to something new. it's really, really not that hard, and it's really, really not that difficult. you just have to get used to it. which you've made pretty clear that you will not do.

lordofduct wrote:large full keypads with the numbers placed amidst it (i.e. blackberry's) - who's going to memorize all those different keys.

well, obviously not you.

lordofduct wrote:The tactile funciton of the entire thing is lost yet again. It's not like a keyboard where you get 10 fingers, it's one thumb for all those keys... and then each key serves multiple purposes, sometimes 3 or 4 'fn's.

learning curve, brah.

lordofduct wrote:stylus assisted dialing (i.e. PPC####) - really now I need a tool to dial (if no one has seen these, they haven't been well introduced to the smart phone market)

i've never heard of this but it sounds ridiculous and cumbersome to me. but what do i know.

lordofduct wrote:voice dialing (i.e. nearly all cell phones) - the phone already has to have the number stored in its database, not very good for new numbers. Furthermore the voice recognition is kind of crap, especially if there is noise disturbance around (i.e. while working!)

mine works fine in my car, where i use it the most. so it's a fine application for me. if it doesn't work for you in your noisy office then fine, don't use it. but, again, don't try and convince me that i'm wrong for knowing how to effectively use something that you don't want to use.

lordofduct wrote:touch scroll (i.e. iPhone) - here's another I have an issue with. The touch screen and different sized fingers come into some weird tactile mishaps... every person I know (yes that's an I, you may not, but I've spent quite a bit of time in the business world) has had many complaints about these features accidently selecting the wrong person, or freezing up mid scroll in very long lists.

this is an annoyance and has happened to me before, but i utilize favorite lists, groups, and recent contacts to work around having to go into my address book every time i need to make a call. because i took the time to adapt to it. and now it's just as easy as dialing with my thumb on a nokia flip phone.

lordofduct wrote:Tell me everyone, do you often look at your phone when dialing? I don't.

neither do i. i know where my fingers are in comparison to the keys on the touchpad.

lordofduct wrote:I know where my fingers are in comparison to the keys.

hey, whaddya know?

lordofduct wrote:There is12 of them, it's relatively easy to know where you are. It's a kin to typing on a keyboard with out looking. This are time honoured design practices that get people jumping on band wagons.

There is a new one though as well... a new design practice... and that is "we'll blow em' out of the water with gimmicks so that they'll be to busy sucking our dicks to complain about what we really screwed up."

i really don't even know where to begin with this so i'll just leave it alone.

lordofduct wrote:Don't get me wrong here. I've already said. I love a lot of the new functionality smart phones, portable pcs, and PDAs bring to the scene. The different apps and the sort are outright stellar. But it's a phone first and foremost... or atleast it's trying to be a phone replacement. So in doing such, they should be pushing the phone side up to normal standards... not just pushing it out of the way. They will be losing many a customer that way... it's just poor design. And I'm not alone in this, I know I'm not. I just happen to be in this crowd of guys who love that they can play their retro consoles on the thing. That's awesome... but I have 30 other devices that do that. But I need a damn phone for fuck sake!

i don't really know how much more clearly i can convey to you that i can use my touchscreen phone with just as much ease as you can use your phone. you can't call something a "poor design" when you won't take the time to see how it can work for you. i've had this phone for about a year, it took me maybe a solid month to get really good at using it. that was a lot quicker than it took me to learn how to drive a stickshift, learn spanish, or figure out the controls on the Oni port for PS2 (after dying a lot, you eventually get it!). to me that's pretty intuitive and user-friendly. there's just some learning and adapting involved.

Actually you did cuss at me... wtf is a cuss word.


Anyways. You enjoying the interface, does not mean it's good design practice. And you thinking a month long learning curve is fine, is also not good design. A phone... should not require a month long learning curve. It just shouldn't. All the extra doo-dads, yeah they can have a learning curve. They aren't staple products, they're new ideas. But a phone, a phone has been around for quite some time.

When portable phones got big in the 80's... my parents got one. Learning the difference from wired to portable was fairly simple and took maybe 30 seconds.

When the first cellphones became popular. Getting used to that was again another minute or so.

When cellphones started getting directories. They again only required maybe a day to get used. A day at most as far as I can remember.

Yeah it takes longer then a month to learn stickshift maybe, or a language... well I don't know about the stick shift. It took me 2 days. But it's a language... languages are extremely complex and serve many jobs. A phone serves a single job. A month? Are you kidding me? No... no.

The fact a game may take a little while to get used to the controls... well a game is an entertainment product. It's not something that you have to know how to play. A phone on the other hand is almost indespensable today... if you expect to be successful in any business, a phone needs to be on your side. Furthermore, it's assumed everyone knows how to use a phone. When you get a job say, telemarketing, they teach you their interface everything... but they assume you know how to use a phone.

The idea that I have to take an entire month to get used to the phone part of my cellphone. That's nonsense. I can consume a brand new programming language in less then that time, a new phone should not be equatable to a new speaking language or programming language.


If you can't see why I think that is bad design. If you can't comprehend that a month is ridiculous. Well then, I give up.

tootles

the problem is you are comparing these devices to conventional phones, which they are not.

aaron wrote:the problem is you are comparing these devices to conventional phones, which they are not.

Yep,

and that was my original point. They aren't phones. They are pocket pc's with really poorly designed phone applications attached to them.

lordofduct wrote:Yes that's a jab at iPhones and a lot of other super-fangle nonsense cellphones that do SO MUCH, and then fail miserably in the design of the 'phone' aspect of the whole deal. I don't have anything against the micro-pc platform in the consideration of the use as a micro or portable computer. But they aren't phones, they're computers with a really crappy phone application installed.

It's my job to recognize good design from bad design. That's what pays my bills.

It's also my job to know what people want and give them what they want. Even if what they want is bad design.

But just because I know that some things people want are bad design, does not mean I'm not allowed to voice my opinion that it's bad design. Shit there's things that I like that are bad design, and I know they're bad design. I still like some of them... but those two are completely independent.