Killing the gaming hobby for today's kids...

[Zodd]

This is just my take and may not be on par with the discussion currently taking place, but it is my take on the topic none the less.

Thanks for the post......the Work Ethic/Instant Gratification point is a valid one.

I have never seen anyone claim that those aren't games. However I have seen many people claim that they are terrible games and thus not specially worthy of artistic attention, which is pretty much true.

Saying Angry Birds or Monopoly are bad games, which they are, is no different than saying Twilight is terrible, which it is. Do you have an issue with poor art being described as such?

In what way are they terrible games? As long as the interface and mechanics perform well with the commands of the user it can't be classified as a terrible game.

How can they be classified as poor art? Angry Birds, Monopoly, and Twilight have engaged their audiences with their concepts.

The range of games has diversified, but the media coverage has not. The media and posts made by the public tend to focus on particular aspects of particular games.

Well said

[Erik_Twice]

In what way are they terrible games?

Note that I didn't say those two games are terrible, I said they are bad, though you could make a case that Monopoly is to boardgames what Twilight is to acting.

Monopoly is a bad game because there's a lot of time wasted on uninteresting ideas such as rolling the dice, moving money from a side to the other, fake decisions like buying a property or not as well ,as bad design flaws like first player advantage, extraordinary amount of randomness, runaway leader problems just to have a very poor and predictable trading game that takes three hours to do what Catan does in half of it's own playtime.

Angry Birds is an artillery game where shooting is uninteresting.

Hence, I would say both are bad.

Don't make me say why Twilight is bad.

How can they be classified as poor art? Angry Birds, Monopoly, and Twilight have engaged their audiences with their concepts.

That they are popular doesn't make them good. Quality is not dependant on how many people like the work in question.

[dsheinem]

Monopoly is a bad game because there's a lot of time wasted on uninteresting ideas such as rolling the dice, moving money from a side to the other, fake decisions like buying a property or not as well ,as bad design flaws like first player advantage, extraordinary amount of randomness, runaway leader problems just to have a very poor and predictable trading game that takes three hours to do what Catan does in half of it's own playtime.

You must suck at Monopoly.

I love Monopoly.

[Erik_Twice]

I love Monopoly.

I love you <33

[MrPopo]

Monopoly is a bad game because there's a lot of time wasted on uninteresting ideas such as rolling the dice, moving money from a side to the other, fake decisions like buying a property or not as well ,as bad design flaws like first player advantage, extraordinary amount of randomness, runaway leader problems just to have a very poor and predictable trading game that takes three hours to do what Catan does in half of it's own playtime.

You must suck at Monopoly.

I love Monopoly.

Yeah, that was my take on it.

[Gunstar Green]

I don't think Angry Birds is a bad game. If I were a kid and Angry Birds were released on the NES I would have played it and enjoyed it. Its fun, simple and accessible gameplay would have been lauded. It would possibly be enjoyed today as a classic of the 8-bit era.

Why is it so bad now? Because it was released today? Is it because it's been milked so much and become something of a pop-culture icon with "non-gamers" that we need to snub our noses at it since it belongs to the common rabble instead of us, the "gamers?"

Is it high-art? No, it's not trying to be either. Neither were a lot of old games that many of us have retroactively labeled as such.

[AznKhmerBoi]

^ Angrybirds is fun, but with new one release its not very inventive.
This is why it differ from Mario or Sonic games, while they are based around the same idea of platforming, each sequel felt different and seems to have more thought provoking design then the simple idea of re-releashing the same old again and again.

Angrybirds to me is just equal that to Tetris, but though Tetris have some iteration, but the core concept still the same.

[J T]

Welcome Zodd! Great first post.

Though there are games for kids, they seem kind of lame to me. I wonder if the kids think they are lame? It doesn't seem like we are making many classics that a kid and adult could both enjoy. There are a few exceptions, like Rayman Origins or Sonic Generations. I don't see the kids of today waxing nostalgic for their early Wii games as much as we old guys do for our NES games.

I think the teens have it golden though. My wife works at a middle school, so I know kids these days are playing and talking about M rated games all the time. I think as a teenager today, playing mature games feels both like doing something more "adult" than you are supposed to be doing, while still being fun. Kind of like what watching R rated movies has always been.

Of course, this is mainly speaking of console and PC games. I guess everything is moving to mobile devices and facebook now and kids today seem to be perpetually plugged into those things. That's an area of gaming I know little about because I stick to consoles and PC. Online free2play is also getting huge and there are a million mmos I don't care about. I guess, I don't know what kids are playing these when it's not a traditional video game like I'm used to.

[Zodd]

If I were a kid and Angry Birds were released on the NES I would have played it and enjoyed it. Its fun, simple and accessible gameplay would have been lauded. It would possibly be enjoyed today as a classic of the 8-bit era.

Great, Great Post, man.

We old folks are forgetting that video games were entertainment and fun (for everyone) before we starting trying to make it completely into "Adults Only" entertainment so that our hobbies can be accepted as grown adults.

[Erik_Twice]

We old folks are forgetting that video games were entertainment and fun (for everyone) before we starting trying to make it completely into "Adults Only" entertainment so that our hobbies can be accepted as grown adults.

When did that happen? I have never seen anyone, forumnite, developer or member of the press say that games should be only for adults. I sincerely believe you are arguing against a strawman here.

But really, I still don't know what are you opposing. It has been three pages and I still don't know, and I'm confident my reading comprenhension is working correctly. Can you point out, exactly, what you oppose?


This is also relevant to the thread:
http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/ar ... ite-of-fun