racketboy.com

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:32 am**

He who has the gold, makes the rules. Works just as well whether there's a god or not.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:41 am**

I agree with that one as well, but I assume you were also being funny.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:41 am**

jp1 wrote:I ask about morality not because I think it is singular to Christianity but because it is something that I can understand from the viewpoint of a Christian but did not understand from the viewpoint of an atheist. Not if they have morals but what they believe about them.

Morality is a social construct, and it has changed over time. In the past it was perfectly moral for people to own slaves, for example. And if you look at all the major world religions at a very high level they all teach the same basic principles, which generally boil down to "do unto others". The reason these continue popping up all over the place is that they are good rules for the survival of our genes and the species. Hell, look at inner city gangs. Even these lawless organizations tend to generate a similar code of conduct among their members because they just make sense.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 11:44 am**

jp1 wrote:Yes, it seems my questions have somehow offended some people. They certainly weren't intended to. There was no implied meaning or hidden agenda. I was genuinely curious.

I ask about morality not because I think it is singular to Christianity but because it is something that I can understand from the viewpoint of a Christian but did not understand from the viewpoint of an atheist. Not if they have morals but what they believe about them.

Thank you Limewater for recognizing that my questions were not an attack on atheist beliefs. It is very hard to phrase any of those questions without treading a line that can be interpreted as trying to convince someone of my beliefs. All I was trying to do was determine if there is an atheist belief about that aspect of life and what it was. The defensive response leads me to believe I wasn't successful in conveying that.

I don't believe this is a terribly accurate statement, either. One criticism I would expect an atheist to level at a Christian would be that they don't ask "why" when it comes to Christian doctrine and morality.

I suppose it is a generalization. I meant more when it comes to questions about life and what it is meant to be. It certainly wasn't specific enough to convey that though.

no no no no no I understood well that you weren't trying to make judgments. I kind of went off on a tangent because the whole "how can atheists be moral if they don't believe in a god?" line of thought generally leads to that misconception. I wasn't trying to direct any of that towards you necessarily at all.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:02 pm**

Ok, good to hear. I didn't want to offend anyone.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:56 pm**

jp1 wrote:A better phrasing of the question at hand to avoid confusion. If you don't believe in god, what do you believe in? As an atheist do you believe there is any purpose in life?

Nope. Life seems to be a happy accident from all the scientific discoveries and verifiable evidence we've figured out so far. I expect to just be dust or worm food when I die. I don't have a death wish or anything, but I just expect to expire and no longer be.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:59 pm**

s1mplehumar wrote:
Octopod wrote:
jp1 wrote:Here's something I was always curious about...

For the non-believers, what do you think causes us to have a conscience? I mean if you don't believe in some kind of afterlife then why not go full primal ape shit and live however you want? Rape, murder, pillage, whatever. Besides the laws that have been put in place by fellow man and those consequences of course.

In Judges 21 the Israelites put to death every man, woman and child in a city except for the virgins whom are to be the spoils of war, given to men as brides. Murder, pilliage and rape. Why did they do that believing in god?

Did you read verse 25 of chapter 21? 21:25 In those days there was no king in Israel: every man did that which was right in his own eyes.

The Israelites turned their backs on God throughout the majority of their Biblical history. Followers of God, and those who deny God alike share a choice. The Israelites (past) did what was right in their own eyes. People today (present) do whatever seems right in their own eyes.

The Israelites CHOSE to ignore God's presence and follow His divine instruction, even though they were still sporadically abiding in the Mosaic Law.

That same passage was first stated in Judges 18:1 and it does not refer to god but an actual Israelite king.

And we both know I could provide dozens upon dozens of other examples from the bible and from actual history.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 1:34 pm**

Octopod wrote:That same passage was first stated in Judges 18:1 and it does not refer to god but an actual Israelite king.

And we both know I could provide dozens upon dozens of other examples from the bible and from actual history.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but there's a whole ton of misleading crap on out there on the internet. I think a lot of the stuff you're reading hasn't been put up against serious scrutiny. Just a quick read through of Judges 21 shows no claimed blessing or instruction from G_d.

A quick rule of thumb: If Israel did it, and it's in the Book of Judges, it was probably wrong.

I don't want to speak with absolute certainty, but I'm pretty sure that there is no G_d-approved wife-stealing in the Bible.

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:04 pm**

I am at school on my phone so ireally can notpost but where did I say they had gods blessing I never said that

Posted: **Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:39 pm**

Octopod wrote:And some animals do rape. Ducks for one.

Did you guys seriously miss this for two pages? No one questioned this at all?

Or is this supposedly common knowledge and ducks just rape each other at the local K-Mart regularly?

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