The Wrestling Thread

[Runefaust]

Saluting is something soldiers do. He's not a soldier. Each time he does that salute is a mockery

That's... an incredibly stupid thing to say. If you follow that logic are you implying that every president of ours that did not serve was mocking our own military each and every time they saluted? You mean to tell me that my best friend's nephew is mocking his father as he salutes him while seeing his father ship off to another country?

You act as if Cena ran over your dog or something... with that being the case there's no point in trying to convince you of anything regarding Cena.

But reviewing most of your comments it's become very clear to me why we have this misunderstanding. You base all your facts and reach your conclusions strictly based upon kayfabe. And with that being the case I really have no beef, nor reason to debate, with you.

[Runefaust]

Logically, you'd think so, but it's almost like the WWE LIKES their top babyface being hated.

Hey, any reaction is reaction. The worst thing for a performer to face is dead silence.

If WWE is trying to pull a HHH (Hollywood Hulk Hogan), then the only time they'd pull the trigger on a heel turn is when the majority of the crowd begin to cheer for Cena as a face again. When you want to see the Hero save the day the most, that's when the Heel turns.

No one elicits the response that Cena does and this is why the WWE is content with his current position. Cena supporters are eager to shout out for their guy, but as always people are louder and more eager to express their discontent. This is why whenever Cena comes out you always have the Cena fans shouting let's go Cena and the anti-Cena posse shouting, louder, Cena sucks!

Cena apparel is selling just as well as it has in the past, but the anti-Cena shirts are one of their hottest selling items they have available. Ironically, the people who hate Cena are actually contributing to his popularity.

Cena is very much an... anti-heel...? I have to agree that he really is the exact opposite of Stone Cold (my personal favorite of all time, and just so happens to be Cena's hero). Stone Cold was trying to come off as a heel but ended up becoming babyface in the eyes of the fans. Cena's achieving the opposite with a huge chunk of the wrestling fans, and like I explained, it's the attitude era demographic who harbor most of that heat.

[BurningDoom]

Saluting is something soldiers do. He's not a soldier. Each time he does that salute is a mockery

That's... an incredibly stupid thing to say. If you follow that logic are you implying that every president of ours that did not serve was mocking our own military each and every time they saluted?

Well technically, the President is military. In the military chain of command that you have to study in basic-training, the President is at the top and has the authority to give orders to any member of the military.

[Gamerforlife]

Saluting is something soldiers do. He's not a soldier. Each time he does that salute is a mockery

That's... an incredibly stupid thing to say. If you follow that logic are you implying that every president of ours that did not serve was mocking our own military each and every time they saluted?

Well technically, the President is military. In the military chain of command that you have to study in basic-training, the President is at the top and has the authority to give orders to any member of the military.

+1

Like I said, Cena has no business saluting

[BurningDoom]

^ Well, it does still seem like a petty reason to hate Cena. I was just pointing out that the President is military.

But to make it clear, I do hate Cena, however I hate Cena because he's been pushed down our throats for years, I hate the squeaky clean persona, I hate his brightly colored goofy-looking outfits, and the guy can't wrestle a real match (well, actually this last year he's impressed me a little in the ring). And I REALLY, REALLY hate how he talks to the camera and the audience like he thinks he's Ferris Bueler. I also hate thug character he originally was, even, that most fans like to point to as the "good ole days" of Cena.

[Luke]

Saluting is something soldiers do. He's not a soldier. Each time he does that salute is a mockery

That's... an incredibly stupid thing to say.

Obviously this is a polarizing topic. "Mockery" and "Stupid" aren't words that should be thrown around.

Two sides of the coin on this one.

One, it's not the act of saluting, it is who represents the salute. JFK's son certainly meant no disrespect or mockery when he saluted his Father's casket. That in mind, a wrestler who pretends to be a Marine doesn't use the best judgment as using the salute as...

...Saluting is a genuine gesticulation of earned respect. It also can be a sign of a myriad of emotions from love to hate. Our members in the armed forces see the salute as a notification of rank and a bond with fellow servicemen. The Salute is a gesture that should never be used lightly, imitated, or in jest.

I would never salute a veteran, as I don't believe I have earned the right to. I do however politely say "Thank you for your service" anytime I see a senior wearing a Vet baseball cap.

If Cena dropped "Hustle" from his slogan and kept "Loyalty and Respect" I wouldn't have any issues with him saluting.


OKAY: Since this topic was brought up, I have to tell a quick story about a marine getting dressed down in a grocery store line. I was behind the guy who received the tail lashing, all I heard first was a strong voice that simply shouted "MARINE!".

The guy in front of me, in full camo gear, snapped back, and addressed a man in plain clothes directly behind me. Apparently you are only allowed to wear your military clothes around civilians under certain circumstances. Picking up groceries isn't one of them.

Homeboy was dressed down for a few minutes in the store, then it moved outside, which I was too busy buying frozen green peas (I remember every detail) to watch.

....
tldr
Saluting depends on context.

[BurningDoom]

OKAY: Since this topic was brought up, I have to tell a quick story about a marine getting dressed down in a grocery store line. I was behind the guy who received the tail lashing, all I heard first was a strong voice that simply shouted "MARINE!".

The guy in front of me, in full camo gear, snapped back, and addressed a man in plain clothes directly behind me. Apparently you are only allowed to wear your military clothes around civilians under certain circumstances. Picking up groceries isn't one of them.

Homeboy was dressed down for a few minutes in the store, then it moved outside, which I was too busy buying frozen green peas (I remember every detail) to watch.

There had to be something else going on there. I was in the Air Force, there's nothing wrong with wearing you're uniform in public. Plenty of times I'd get off of my shift and go grocery shopping, pick up something to eat, or pick up comics or something. But you are expected to act a certain way if you do because you're representing the Air Force if you do so.

[Luke]

OKAY: Since this topic was brought up, I have to tell a quick story about a marine getting dressed down in a grocery store line. I was behind the guy who received the tail lashing, all I heard first was a strong voice that simply shouted "MARINE!".

The guy in front of me, in full camo gear, snapped back, and addressed a man in plain clothes directly behind me. Apparently you are only allowed to wear your military clothes around civilians under certain circumstances. Picking up groceries isn't one of them.

Homeboy was dressed down for a few minutes in the store, then it moved outside, which I was too busy buying frozen green peas (I remember every detail) to watch.

There had to be something else going on there. I was in the Air Force, there's nothing wrong with wearing you're uniform in public. Plenty of times I'd get off of my shift and go grocery shopping, pick up something to eat, or pick up comics or something. But you are expected to act a certain way if you do because you're representing the Air Force if you do so.

Perhaps the Marines are different. I am certainly not an expert, but I remember the ranking official asking questions such as:

Are you in active duty?
Are you currently in deployment?*
When is your next date of active duty?
When is the last time you reported to duty?
Do you plan on seeing family tonight?

But those questions were just a drop in the bucket. I have no clue why, but something set the plain clothes guy off.


*Could have been "are you being deployed". Looks like I don't remember every detail after all.

[Gamerforlife]

^ Well, it does still seem like a petty reason to hate Cena. I was just pointing out that the President is military.

But to make it clear, I do hate Cena, however I hate Cena because he's been pushed down our throats for years, I hate the squeaky clean persona, I hate his brightly colored goofy-looking outfits, and the guy can't wrestle a real match (well, actually this last year he's impressed me a little in the ring). And I REALLY, REALLY hate how he talks to the camera and the audience like he thinks he's Ferris Bueler. I also hate thug character he originally was, even, that most fans like to point to as the "good ole days" of Cena.

Well, the salute thing is just one of the reasons I don't like him. If they are doing a tribute to the troops type thing, I'd be fine with it. Saluting the audience would actually be appropriate as a sign of respect since you know everyone there is a soldier. Though, it's not something I would personally do because as Luke said I don't feel I've earned the right. I just don't know why he does it at every show. It just seems silly. What's the point? It's not like he is a military character gimmick like Sgt. Slaughter. Plus, he's not a soldier himself. So....why? Is Cena supposed to represent the military in some way? I don't see how he does. He doesn't dress in full military garb. He's never served so WHY THE HELL DOES HE DO THAT!!!

Sorry, but it just annoys the hell out of me. It seems egotistical in a way, because the WWE and many of its wrestlers are known to support the military but it's almost like Cena's trying to say, "nobody here supports the military more than me", which seems rather self important and dickish, which is how I view Cena in general.

If He just does it to remind us of that movie The Marine, then he really is dumb.

Oh, and the thug thing is lame too because Cena has never been a "thug" or been in a gang in his life. At least, The Rock persona doesn't necessarily contradict who Duane Johnson really is, but Cena tries to act like this thug/chain gang thing of his is a legit part of who he is. What a joke. Rock's line about Cena going to private school (which is true) really hit home. Maybe that's why Cena came out with that cheap shot, below the belt promo on your arm thing

[BurningDoom]

Who Is Your Guilty Pleasure Wrestler?

What are some wrestlers that you like that aren't exactly well-liked or considered good?

Mine is The Ultimate Warrior



The guy is nuttier than Chip N Dale, and has one of the worst reputations as a professional in the industry. But as a kid, I knew nothing of this and I ate every second up that he was on my T.V. screen. I was definitely one of the "Little Warriors". So he brings a ton of nostalgia factor in for me. And the match between Hogan and The Ultimate Warrior in the Champion vs. Champion main-event at Wrestlemania VI was like the ultimate childhood wrestling moment for me.

BTW, if no one has seen The Self-Destruction of The Ultimate Warrior DVD, you really should. It's VERY entertaining and laugh-out-loud at times. They probably portrayed it more extremely than he actually is, but from what I've heard and read about the guy, it's not too far from the truth:

Self destruction of the Ultimate Warrior part 1

Crappy quality, but it's free. If you want better quality, the DVD is easy to find and cheap.