Hunger and Famine in Somalia :(

[AznKhmerBoi]

shoot even a 1 party government like those of Vietnam and China wouldnt be too shabby either

The time of tribes has passed, yet they continue to hold on to that lifestyle to their own detriment. It would help if they had democratic traditions, but they don't.

Don't you think that's a bit ethnocentric?

[BoringSupreez]

The time of tribes has passed, yet they continue to hold on to that lifestyle to their own detriment. It would help if they had democratic traditions, but they don't.

Don't you think that's a bit ethnocentric?

Maybe. But, historically, democracies work better in the modern world (past 2 centuries) than any other form of government.

[jfrost]

UN has tried to impose democracy in Somalia since Siad Barre fell from power in 1991. The result has been bloodshed.

There's no point in keeping a unified Somali state, since the people obviously don't think of themselves as a united country. Somaliland, Puntland, and Mogadishu itself are very different worlds, and trying to submit them to the authority of the provisional government (which is located in Kenya, by the way) will only end up in civil war.

The UN can cry all they want about not being able to reach the refugees to give them food. They should try, incidentaly, to stop fucking bombing the people. It might help. Same goes for the US, that has been dropping bombs there for quite a while, and even actually invaded Somalia in 2009 (and continued to back the Kenyan troops that invaded since).

[jfrost]

shoot even a 1 party government like those of Vietnam and China wouldnt be too shabby either

The Somalis were doing remarkably well, considering their resources, prior to everyone bombing them and trying to submit them to a government. I reckon they would do just fine if left alone.

[AznKhmerBoi]

^ yea maybe the US should stay out of this, like they did with Cambodia, Vietnam, and Laos after the Vietnam war.

All those countries now are stablize and moving towards properous years.
Ever since the creation of ASEAN the whole region have seen improvements in all fields except Human Rights

It took all but 20 something years to rebuilt but its lookings good.

[saturnfan]

The time of tribes has passed, yet they continue to hold on to that lifestyle to their own detriment. It would help if they had democratic traditions, but they don't.

Don't you think that's a bit ethnocentric?

I have never had a problem with being ethnocentric as I believe our culture and western style democratic republic is superior to that of a failed African state. But don't confuse that with a desire to intervene and remold societies, since people of other societies and cultures intrinsically believe their way of life to be superior to mine, and I take no issue with that.

But back to topic at hand, one of the problems with Africa as a whole is that their tribal way of life has been threatened and destroyed through the modern nation state, states that the African's did not establish themselves (in most cases). During the scramble for Africa (late 1870s to approximately 1910), the major colonial powers carved up the continent and established arbitrary boarders irrespective of the people who lived there. This in turn put tribes, many of which who were of different ethnic groups and not historically friends, under a shared colonial jurisdiction.

Fast forward to the 1950s and these old colonies are granted independence. Guess what? Now you have a modern nation state comprised of people who are not necessarily on friendly terms with each other, have had their land raped for 60 years, and have now been dragged into the modern national scene of politics without having a tradition of inter tribal or ethnic friendliness. These are all recipes for disaster. In my opinion, African countries need to take cue from the recent secession of South Sudan and start developing new countries that are relatively culturally and ethnically similar.

[AznKhmerBoi]

^ thanks on that very insightful info. But lets not jump start the gun on the situation of Sudan split. Only time can tell if they will prosper or not, as of right now im still having doubt about the successfulness of the succession of sudan

[Mr.White555]

The time of tribes has passed, yet they continue to hold on to that lifestyle to their own detriment. It would help if they had democratic traditions, but they don't.

Don't you think that's a bit ethnocentric?

Maybe. But, historically, democracies work better in the modern world (past 2 centuries) than any other form of government.

I believe you mean nationalism instead of democracy. Its a misnomer to call them democracies. The modern world is full of republics.

Anyways I do agree that the West's political intrusions are detrimental to the development of stable governments in the third world. Foreigners aren't going to change a damn thing unless it is embraced by the people.

[saturnfan]

^ thanks on that very insightful info. But lets not jump start the gun on the situation of Sudan split. Only time can tell if they will prosper or not, as of right now im still having doubt about the successfulness of the succession of sudan

This is true, but hopefully it moves both nations in a better direction.

[BRIK]

That fat kid reminds me of Michelin Man