Anyone think Batman Begins is a little overrated?

[Gamerforlife]

Burton's films a bit campy yes, but I don't think the original went overboard with it. Though you can argue that Batman Returns did. I'm really kind of focusing on the first movie though. Given that Batman Begins is the first of the new franchise, it's a valid comparison. You want campy? Watch the Adam West tv show. Burton wasn't THAT bad. He kept the character dark, he kept Gotham dark, he kept Catwoman and Joker's origins dark too. He stayed much truer to the source material than Schumacher did. I'm surprised by how much Burton is getting bashed in this thread. There might not have even been a Batman Begins or an animated series if it wasn't for the success Burton had with Batman.

Oh, and when I referred to the death of Bruce's parents being done better by Burton, I meant the actual moment of their deaths. The scene played well, in Batman Begins it really didn't play well at all. You know it seemed like they actually wanted to spend some time fleshing out Bruce's dad a bit so we could feel his sense of loss more, but due to either the writing or the actor, it just didn't work. Burton simply avoided all that and just focused on showing the actual murder and making it as chilling as possible. It worked better.

Animated Joker does a reality tv broadcast in Justice League season 2, cracking jokes and being CAMPY the whole time, then reveals he's been hypnotizing everyone to make them go insane. Not too different from Nicholson doing a parade and throwing money to the crowd in Burton's movie while dancing and smiling, then trying to kill everyone. They're the same character. Who do you think Mark Hamill most likely based the character off of. And a little camp can work for some Batman characters. If you've never seen any camp in the cartoons, you weren't paying attention. Particularly with Wonder Woman in Justice League. And hello? Harley Quinn? It's funny to me that there are campy elements in Batman Begins(that I've already mentioned), but people tend to overlook them and talk about how realistic and "sophisticated" Batman Begins is. Anyway, the best portrayal of Joker may have been in the uncensored Batman Beyond:Return of the Joker. He's more sinister and genuinely creepy than ever in that movie, and even a little cocky.

I loved that movie by the way(again, the uncensored version), probably the darkest animated Batman story ever done. Speaking of dark, anyone looking forward to Bruce Timm's Superman Doomsday? Comes out this month

[wyatt]

Justice League has an entirely different tone than the Batman series from the nineties, I wouldn't hold it up for comparison when the topic is Batman alone. I would also discount the newer show, "The Batman". Admittadly I have only seen a couple of them but was not impressed, anyone else seen more of that? Seems like bandwagoning art style tacked onto a franchise character.

I am a great fan of Batman Beyond, Batman with a sci-fi-like theme done well, who'da thought hehe. Had em bootleg before official discs were released. Also looking forward to Doomsday, maybe we get to see the brutal beatings of many of DC's greatest heroes and not just Supe!

[tHePhAnToM!??!]

Ummm harvery dent was black in the animated series. I thought it was cool. Jack as the joker to me is the best. The only thing that was wrong with jack being the joker is that joker is pretty tall. Thats why heath ledger is ok by me. Hopefully his acting will be up to par. The only thing in Batman Begins that bothers me is the "batman" voice. thats it. I think Keaton was the best Wayne and Batman. Remember Wayne was not the nicest guy. He was a bit of an asshole because he was and is bitter. Something he gets rid of when he gets his back broken by bane. (That will teach anyone). As for bale. This is Bale man. He is probably one of the best and most dedicated actors of my generation. American Psycho was just awesomeo. Begins was a really good come up after we got dished the Kilmer and Clooney pussy treatment. But in the Machinist is when i was like wtf.

If any of you saw that movie you would have seen how Bale looked. Man that freaked me out. Then in just like 3 months he got to the size of Batman. He was the only good thing in Reign of Fire. And 3:10 to Yuma looks good. I did like the original. I forget the prestige. That movie was pretty dam good. I just get mad when the movies do not follow the comics. Thats all. Like honestly spider man pissed me off when they threw the web cartridges out the window. Do not ask me why it just did. Almost all of the comic based movies make me mad. Wow I got off topic. I like the Batman Begins movie. There enough said.

[Mozgus]

I doubt you would have seen a Penguin-carrying funeral procession of mind controlled rocket launching penguins in the animated series honestly trying to appear solemn.

Hahahaha oh god, thank you for that. But actually, you might have. Penguin in TAS was pretty goofy, though he was MUCH better represented in the Cartoon. In Returns he's just a snarling monster.

If you've never seen any camp in the cartoons, you weren't paying attention. Particularly with Wonder Woman in Justice League. And hello? Harley Quinn?

Woah woah now, don't say anything you'll regret. Harley Quinn is OFF-LIMITS from bashing.

Ummm harvery dent was black in the animated series.

1/4th black at best.

[Gamerforlife]

Who said I was bashing Harley Quinn? I'm just pointing out that she never was in the comics prior to the cartoon because she might have been considered a little too goofy for post-Miller Batman stories, but she worked with well with the animated version of Joker. So good, they did put her in the comic continuity afterwords.

Penguin in the cartoon was based off Tim Burton's version. Although, when the cartoon went to the WB I think it was, they no longer were required to retain Burton's influences so many characters obtained a cosmetic makeover, for better and for worse. Penguin's new look was less goofy. I disliked the new designs for Catwomen and Joker though. They kind of went back to Joker's original design later though it seems. A few designs worked well and were retained for Justice League.

And if Mosgus is looking for some Harley Quinn love, I recently rewatched Mad Love on DVD. Really the best Harley Quinn story ever. I even own the original short story. It really covers everything about her character. Her origin, her charm, her insanity, not to mention how smart and dangerous she can be when she puts her mind to something. What I really love about that episode is its disturbingly realistic portrayal of domestic abuse. It really took that episode above the level of kids cartoon, and made it one that is hard to get out of your head. I won't spoil it for anyone reading this who hasn't seen it, but there's a very shocking scene towards the end. It' wass actually a heart wrenching scene for me to watch

I love how they retain continuity consistency too. In the Justice League episode "Wild Cards", we again see some of that abusive relationship. I'm surprised they've always been so honest about the nature of Joker and Harley's relationship and never dumbed down the violence

Oh, and did you see that episode where they introduced The Creeper, Harley has a GREAT line about "having some of her pie". My god, I love how they get away with stuff like that in a kids cartoon