The home/family PC and gaming mix - what to do?

[marurun]

I've been doing a lot of thinking about PCs lately since our at-home family PC and gaming environment has been chaotic lately. My gaming PC, which is perfectly powerful for almost any daily task and very functional for 1080p gaming for any game older than 5 years, is not OK for Windows 11. My laptop, which is ancient, finally has not even a lick of battery charge left (unplug the cord and it turns off instantly), heats up in 5 seconds flat, and grinds away even with an SSD and extra RAM. My wife's touch-screen laptop has always had an on-off relationship with its own touchpad and also has issues being responsive. And we don't have a family PC because at only 8 my kid has his hands full with his at-school Chromebook, a Switch, and a Fire tablet.

So with all our laptops ready to bite the dust (or having already done so) and my desktop's Windows 10 nearing EOL we need a functional at-home PC environment. I also need to figure out how games work into the picture. No PS4s or PS5s or Xboxen of any sort in this house, only Switches and phones and tablets. Given the amount of time I've had for gaming, this has actually been OK, even over-generous. But someday I want to be able to play something truly current-gen. But we also need adequate computing resources in the house.

Here are my thoughts so far:

M4 Mac Mini for the family computer. I have a 30" 1080p monitor that would just love to have someplace to be, so I could pair that with the Mini and have a perfectly functional home computer for stuff like dealing with PDF forms, printing random nonsense, accessing web sites, all that BS. It would also be nice to have a Mac back in my life and the kid could use it for Minecraft if he needs more power than his humble Fire tablet can provide.

14" laptop from a reliable brand with good CPU and memory (at least 16 GB), maybe some kind of extended warranty as long as there's an option that also covers battery life, because now even the batteries are no longer user-replaceable. Laptops went from mostly disposable to truly disposable. The key would be to get something compact, reliable, and affordable, without going too cheap. I'm guessing maybe $500-600 for the Mini (edu discount, maybe 3 yr AppleCare) and another $700 for the laptop. This way we will have both Mac and Windows available in the household. I'm a big fan of heterogenous computing.

We will probably jump on the next gen Switch for gaming, and I may try installing SteamOS on my old gaming PC, or a Linux distro that's particularly Steam-friendly. I'll lose access to some games, but that was probably always going to happen.

But after that? When will I feel ready to buy an actual REAL gaming desktop PC again (real as in discrete graphics, even if the budget still tops out around $1000)? Or would I be better off getting a PS5 or Xbox Series X, or whatever comes after those? It's frustrating to figure this stuff out because the money adds up.

So what kind of computing/gaming mix do you have at home? If you have a family, how do you deal with the varied computing and gaming needs of your household?

[Ziggy]

It's hard to say what YOU should do, I can only chime in with my own thoughts on what I do for myself and see if that helps you any.

What are the specs of the gaming PC? Because you can still install Windows 11 on unsupported hardware. And in fact, Microsoft just recently and officially gave instructions no how to do so. People are speculating it's because of the insane market share that 10 still has versus 11. If things don't change in the next 10 months, they might just have to extend support for 10. Anyway, it seems like Microsoft's stance on installing 10 on unsupported hardware went from "You can't do it" to "Well, you can, but we rather you didn't."

Also, Intel just released what looks like an amazing budget GPU. It's $250 and looks like it has good performance and compatibility in benchmarks, especially for 1080p gaming. It looks like it will be a great card to upgrade an older rig with, or for a new budget build.

So if the CPU in your old gaming PC wouldn't be too much of a bottleneck, there's the possibility of throwing in Intel's new B580 and upgrading to 11 anyway (if/when). That could hold you over for a while, if that's what you need. That's what I would try and do. If the CPU would be too much of a bottleneck, then I would just try and build a new rig.

Laptops went from mostly disposable to truly disposable.

Yeah, every time I look at laptops for someone, they just appear to all be garbage. That said, do you truly need a laptop? Can you get away with a tablet instead? Keeping in mind that some tablets can have keyboard attachments and sorta function like a laptop. Of course, you can't do all the same things on a tablet. But I don't know what use you have for a laptop.

But after that? When will I feel ready to buy an actual REAL gaming desktop PC again (real as in discrete graphics, even if the budget still tops out around $1000)? Or would I be better off getting a PS5 or Xbox Series X, or whatever comes after those? It's frustrating to figure this stuff out because the money adds up.

I think, in the end, you're always better off with a good PC over a gaming console. They can do more than gaming. They can be more reliable. They're more repairable. And they can stay relevant a lot longer, if you can upgrade certain parts.

That said, the console is still very nice because of how easy and simple it is to use. PC gaming can still sometimes be a pain in the ass. Compatibility issues, finding the right graphic settings, etc. But if you don't mind putting in a little effort from time to time, you can have a better gaming experience with a PC. With a BT adapter you can use a PS or Xbox controller and game on a TV, and at that point it's no different from the console experience (except potentially better graphics).

PS - Super tired right now, so I'm sure this isn't the most well written post!

[marurun]

My PC has a Skylake-era CPU in it, so I would have to build an all-new thing. Were I without a child a desktop would have more appeal, but a laptop can be ported around the house as needed for not just web browsing but full on MS Office level shenanigans. And these days a really nice tablet with a good keyboard costs almost as much as a decent laptop. If we are to have a desktop it needs to be a family desktop. But maybe I could try to justify a gaming-capable desktop for the family and a Mac laptop. If o ly there was a sub-$1k 14” laptop. 13” is just a hair too cramped.

[pierrot]

I've been going through a somewhat similar thought process recently. I don't own any game consoles newer than the WiiU and probably never will. I built a computer a little over five years ago with a Ryzen 7 3700 and Geforce RTX 2700 Super; So it has no problems running pretty much anything at 1080p, but for whatever reason it's not compatible with Windows 11 either. (I think it might have been the TPM requirement, and I'm really not keen on dealing with that.) I bought a Lenovo Legion laptop around the beginning of the year though, which came with Windows 11 and has like a 4700 in it. I don't use it for games, but it is built for that.

Anyway, I kind of hate Windows 11 to begin with, and all the tinkering I've been doing with games in Linux on the Steam Deck has me feeling like just throwing Fedora on my desktop. For a lot of things that aren't "deck compatible," there are still ways to get them setup to run in Linux, and it's a hell of a lot less of a struggle than all the BS I used to do in Wine to get Windows games playable in OSX years ago.

At this point, I'd kind of like to get away from Windows in general, but for work purposes it would probably be good to have on my laptop anyway. Perhaps I just want to actually set up a Linux partition on it, though.

One thing to keep in mind for your specific case is if you're okay with using Lutris, basically any Linux distro is Steam friendly. SteamOS is probably only useful if you want to keep everything in the Steam environment, or really like big picture mode or something. With the Steam Deck I feel like SteamOS is a borderline must just because of the hardware, but for a typical PC, I don't think I would ever personally feel like choosing SteamOS over some other Linux distro.

[Ziggy]

My PC has a Skylake-era CPU in it, so I would have to build an all-new thing. Were I without a child a desktop would have more appeal, but a laptop can be ported around the house as needed for not just web browsing but full on MS Office level shenanigans. And these days a really nice tablet with a good keyboard costs almost as much as a decent laptop. If we are to have a desktop it needs to be a family desktop. But maybe I could try to justify a gaming-capable desktop for the family and a Mac laptop. If o ly there was a sub-$1k 14” laptop. 13” is just a hair too cramped.

For the CPU in the old desktop... This would matter which socket you have, and what the motherboard/BIOS supports, but you could max out that CPU. I love doing this for older desktops. Find out what the best CPUs would be for your motherboard, then look them up on eBay. Often times when the PC is older you can get a top of the line CPU for really cheap. That might breathe enough new life into your desktop to keep it going a tad longer.

Yes, better tablets can cost as much or more than a laptop. But they also seem to be better build, so there's that. Also, staying a gen behind with an iPad seems to be totally fine. Isn't MS Office available on tablets? But I'm not trying to talk you into getting a tablet over a laptop. Laptops can simply do a lot more, and are better at many tasks too. I'm just throwing this out there.

I built a computer a little over five years ago with a Ryzen 7 3700 and Geforce RTX 2700 Super; So it has no problems running pretty much anything at 1080p, but for whatever reason it's not compatible with Windows 11 either. (I think it might have been the TPM requirement, and I'm really not keen on dealing with that.)

I bet it is compatible with 11. You might just have to turn on various settings in the UEFI. I built a PC in 2019 with a Ryzen 2700X and the motherboard supports 11. Also in Windows 10, it tells me that my PC does not support 11. I didn't have the correct settings in the UEFI for TPM I think. But even after fixing the UEFI settings, Windows still reports that it doesn't support 11. So I found out that it's because when I installed 10, based on the UEFI settings at the time, it installed with an MBR partition. Microsoft actually has a tool for converting an existing Windows 10 MBR installtion to GPT. And if I do that, then I should be able to upgrade to 11 (if I want to, at least).

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 1405f800d7

[marurun]

One thing to keep in mind for your specific case is if you're okay with using Lutris, basically any Linux distro is Steam friendly. SteamOS is probably only useful if you want to keep everything in the Steam environment, or really like big picture mode or something. With the Steam Deck I feel like SteamOS is a borderline must just because of the hardware, but for a typical PC, I don't think I would ever personally feel like choosing SteamOS over some other Linux distro.

That's a good point. I have dabbled with Linux in the past but I'm certainly not fluent by any means. I would probably want a distro that's as hands-off as possible, which for Linux is an iffy proposition.

For the CPU in the old desktop... This would matter which socket you have, and what the motherboard/BIOS supports, but you could max out that CPU. I love doing this for older desktops. Find out what the best CPUs would be for your motherboard, then look them up on eBay. Often times when the PC is older you can get a top of the line CPU for really cheap. That might breathe enough new life into your desktop to keep it going a tad longer.

I mean, the problem isn't the hardware, it's Windows. And I definitely couldn't install an Intel Battlemage in anything with that CPU because nothing would have the resizable BAR. I cannot make this CPU ever truly comfortable with Windows 11.

[pierrot]

I bet it is compatible with 11. You might just have to turn on various settings in the UEFI. I built a PC in 2019 with a Ryzen 2700X and the motherboard supports 11. Also in Windows 10, it tells me that my PC does not support 11. I didn't have the correct settings in the UEFI for TPM I think. But even after fixing the UEFI settings, Windows still reports that it doesn't support 11. So I found out that it's because when I installed 10, based on the UEFI settings at the time, it installed with an MBR partition. Microsoft actually has a tool for converting an existing Windows 10 MBR installtion to GPT. And if I do that, then I should be able to upgrade to 11 (if I want to, at least).

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 1405f800d7

Thanks for the deets, that's good to know, but I would really rather just install Linux at that point, to be totally honest.

That's a good point. I have dabbled with Linux in the past but I'm certainly not fluent by any means. I would probably want a distro that's as hands-off as possible, which for Linux is an iffy proposition.

Linux Mint is a really hands-off distro. I assume it's probably the most pre-configured still, and kind of resembles OSX graphically (or, at least, I imagine it could be configured with the KDE Plasma environment pretty easily). I used to dual boot Mint with OSX years ago, for no real reason other than to try to impress my friend who eats, sleeps and shits Linux. It was really easy to use with just some basic computer skills and no real prior knowledge of Linux.

[Ziggy]

Another reason I have to convert my MBR to GPT, apparently this is needed to turn on resize BAR without having other issues.

I'm really not a "Linux guy," but I have been using distros on and off for years now. I've been using Linux Mint MATE on an old (2010) laptop and an old slimline desktop. It can be very hands off. I'm really not a console guy, only as a last resort and I still need my hand to be held. And I've rarely had the need to in Mint, with basic everyday type tasks. It's easy to install and configure for auto updates, then at that point you really don't need to do much. I'd say it's on the level of Windows, in regards to setup and updates.

[opa]

Curious if you came up with any solutions, maru.

I'm currently researching a dedicated Linux build.

[MrPopo]

Knowing you Maru, if you try a Linux distro you're going to run into just enough things that annoy you that you'll regret it.