The Wrestling Thread

[Raging Justice]

Never forget what WWE really thinks of Cody Rhodes when you remove all of that clout that he got from AEW

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/ ... _on_tv_in/

No one ever really viewed Cody as a top guy, or even a top mid carder. He was a JOKE. Incidentally, some of his best work in AEW was as the masked joke character Fuego Dos that he started playing when everyone was booing him in AEW. A throwback to his Stardust days, that was the only time he got cheers at that point in time. Presumably, people didn't realize it was him under the mask. Cody didn't make himself into a star like Steve Austin, Hogan, The Rock, etc. WWE just DECIDED he would be the top guy when he came back to WWE because of his AEW connection, despite the fact that AEW fans were booing the shit out of him at every arena AEW went to before he left. Cody was getting real, "Go away" heat from the crowds. That's the real "story" of Cody Rhodes. They guy is a real narcissist by the way. He is now taking credit for Sami Zayne, Jey Uso, and Seth Rollins getting over

'I heard Mr. Heyman say this and I know it's true because he didn't tell me directly. A byproduct of my return, he said, this is his words, it allowed the traditional babyface to come back. They were growing elsewhere, these babyfaces. Two prime examples are Sami Zayn and Jey Uso, who is now the face, with Seth [Seth Rollins], the face of Monday Night Raw. I know he didn't tell me that directly, and never will, but that felt like, 'What a cool thing to maybe be able to claim. You were helpful in bringing that in.' - Cody Rhodes

FUCKING...POLITICIAN

Anyway, it's nice to post a great match every now and then. Joshi fans worship Manami Toyota. I don't know too much about her as I really am a novice about Japanese wrestling, but I did see an exploding barbed wire death match she had once that was epic and I think I had posted it in this thread. Here's another well regarded match of hers. Hopefully, you guys checked out the Mayu Iwatani vs Sareee match I posted before too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzD_QyYB45s

I gotta try finding some of Asuka's early, pre WWE matches and posting them here.

Since we had such a great time in Oaxaca, my wife and I just booked a trip to Mexico City. We’re heading down there in the fall, and one item on out itinerary is a visit to Arena Mexico for a lucha libre show. I am so excited to be heading to one of the best pro wresting venues in the world, and I can’t wait to tell you all about it!

Someone's living their best life

Do you know what show it is?

[prfsnl_gmr]

Damn right!

We watched Cassandro (2023) not that long ago, and when we were planning the trip, I was like, “You know…we could go to the legendary venue where Cassandra fought Hijo del Santo…maybe even see a show…” My wonderful wife is totally down for that.

CMLL wrestles there, apparently. It looks like it draws U.S. performers like Daniel Bryanson from time-to-time too. Should b fun, even if I’ll have only a limited understanding of the storylines.

[Raging Justice]

Damn right!

We watched Cassandro (2023) not that long ago, and when we were planning the trip, I was like, “You know…we could go to the legendary venue where Cassandra fought Hijo del Santo…maybe even see a show…” My wonderful wife is totally down for that.

CMLL wrestles there, apparently. It looks like it draws U.S. performers like Daniel Bryanson from time-to-time too. Should b fun, even if I’ll have only a limited understanding of the storylines.

I was hoping it was a CMLL show. I think AAA is the biggest promotion down there, but they had their biggest show of the year recently and I heard it was terrible. AAA's reputation is suffering of late. CMLL seems like a pretty respected promotion with a very long history. I believe it is the oldest pro wrestling promotion in existence. Yeah, CMLL has been working a bit with AEW recently, hence the Daniel Bryan appearance. They had a storyline going on about CMLL kind of "invading" AEW. It led to some fun matches between AEW and CMLL talent. If you do a youtube search for AEW CMLL it should pull up some videos and matches from AEW that'll get you familiar with some of CMLL's talent. It was certainly my first exposure to many of these guys. That's a nice thing about AEW, they like to expose fans to many wrestlers from different places.

Stephanie Vaqer is their women's champion, tag team champion, as well as holding the Women's Strong title from New Japan Pro Wresting (which she won by defeating former Stardom star Giulia shortly before Giulia appeared in WWE). She's pretty awesome and I hope she'll make some kind of appearance in AEW at some point. If she still has her Women's Strong title come time for AEW's Forbidden Door pay per view I think it's almost mandatory she'll have to defend the title on that show.

If you check out the first match of the following show, you'll see a pretty great match between her and AEW star (and former WWE star) Mercedes Moné with English commentary. This was a while back before she had all of those titles that she currently holds so you could say she's become a bit of a bigger deal since this match happened. This show was the first time I had ever seen or heard of her and I came away pretty impressed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQaF8SnPrbI

Here's a very cool recent picture of her with her titles:



EDIT: If reprise is reading this, that show I linked to is where the current feud between Mercedes Moné and Willow Nightingale started.

[Raging Justice]

I saw a thread on a certain forum where most of the posts are full of trolls, toxic people, and idiots that was surprisingly thoughtful. This person wondered why AEW is not enjoying more success and did a pretty decent job running down many of the people on the roster and pointing out how talented they are. What's interesting is that he covered A LOT of people and yet still forget to mention quite a few names (he doesn't seem to be a fan of any of the women unfortunately). That's how STACKED with talent AEW is. I'm just gonna copy/paste what he said:

"Malakai Black - He could easily be a modern age Jake the Snake Roberts. He has that aura about him.

Buddy Mathews - one of the best wrestlers in the World. Give him the TNT title, let him dominate defending the tite every week

Samoe Joe - One of the most unique wrestlers in the World. He has the look, the skills. He look credible as a monster. Can beat you physically and can choke you out.

Edge - Can talk, can wrestle, shined as one of the biggest stars in the World in the WWE

Christian - One of the best heels in the World

Okada - one of the best wrestlers in the World. Looks like a million bucks

Wardlow - looks good, is credible as Hell as this badass. Was over as Hell a few years ago

Will Ospray - most gifted high flyer in the World

Swerve Strickland - the guy has the "it" factor. Insane presence.

Claudio - can beat the shit out of you and he is one of the best wrestlers as well. AEW could use the opportuniy that WWE never gave him

Bryan Danielson - Best wrestler in the World

Jon Moxley - when he came to AEW he was breaking all ratings records. He is a star though and through.

Miro - One of the most underbooked WWE wrestlers ever. The guy is money. He can brawl and wrestles.

Penta - the guy understand psychology. He is a fantastic wrestler. Look at his work in Lucha Underground.

Fenix - one of the most skilled high flyer ever

Ricky Starks - skills, charisma, he has it all

Adam Page - we have had issues with him but he is a freaking great wrestler. And a few years ago he was over as Hell

Powerhorse Hobbs - very impressive power guy

Darby Allin - modern Jeff Hardy. Charisma, daredevil

Brian Cage - incredible agiliy for his size

Killswitch - unique guy that can do nice moves for his size

Kenny Omega - one of the best wrestlers in the World

Big Bill - impressive looking monster. the guy is monster.

And many more.

How the fuck you can't better with these guys?

I often watch Raw and Smackdown and these guys barely have a roster with the brand split. It's always the same guys. AEW doesn't have such limits. There's no reasons they could not be WAY more successful with that roster."

[Reprise]

Those are some interesting thoughts. I was looking at the recent Dynamite ratings, which have been some of the worst in the company's history the last two weeks, and I have also been observing the attitude online which I would say is now outright hostility towards everything and anything AEW right now. People really despise the company right now.

AEW has had a very difficult 2023 (and arguably 2022 was turbulent too), but I think objectively AEW has been improving this year. I have found Dynamite (and Rampage and Collision when I watch them) more engaging. We have also talked about how AEW has improved its presentation in recent weeks. On top of that, we have back-to-back outstanding PPVs, Sting's retirement, the signings of Okada, Ospreay and Mone. Okada has been booked perfectly as a heel. We have had Swerve breaking through the glass ceiling and a perfectly executed double turn between Hangman and Swerve. Joe was also a fantastic champion that held it during a transition period for the company. Christian has also had an incredible run that far surpasses everything I ever imagined it would be. People's reactions to AEW should be far more positive than they are imo.

It's like we are witnessing a delayed response to all the issues they had in 2023 or something. I see so many people shitting on AEW right now and I don't really get it as a wrestling fan. Whereas at some points last year and 2022, I would have probably agreed at times.

AEW isn't perfect, there's plenty I criticise about it, but it does seem to be trying to address criticism.

Voices of Wrestling recently conducted a fan survey on AEW and posted their findings and analysis, which is quite interesting: https://www.voicesofwrestling.com/2024/ ... y-results/

[Raging Justice]

Those are some interesting thoughts. I was looking at the recent Dynamite ratings, which have been some of the worst in the company's history the last two weeks, and I have also been observing the attitude online which I would say is now outright hostility towards everything and anything AEW right now. People really despise the company right now.

AEW has had a very difficult 2023 (and arguably 2022 was turbulent too), but I think objectively AEW has been improving this year. I have found Dynamite (and Rampage and Collision when I watch them) more engaging. We have also talked about how AEW has improved its presentation in recent weeks. On top of that, we have back-to-back outstanding PPVs, Sting's retirement, the signings of Okada, Ospreay and Mone. Okada has been booked perfectly as a heel. We have had Swerve breaking through the glass ceiling and a perfectly executed double turn between Hangman and Swerve. Joe was also a fantastic champion that held it during a transition period for the company. Christian has also had an incredible run that far surpasses everything I ever imagined it would be. People's reactions to AEW should be far more positive than they are imo.

It's like we are witnessing a delayed response to all the issues they had in 2023 or something. I see so many people shitting on AEW right now and I don't really get it as a wrestling fan. Whereas at some points last year and 2022, I would have probably agreed at times.

AEW isn't perfect, there's plenty I criticise about it, but it does seem to be trying to address criticism.

Voices of Wrestling recently conducted a fan survey on AEW and posted their findings and analysis, which is quite interesting: https://www.voicesofwrestling.com/2024/ ... y-results/

Ironically, I think I saw a negative review of this past Wednesday's three hour show on voices of wrestling's website. I thought AEW put on a good three hour show last Wednesday, even Jericho's match was fun and entertained the crowd though they had a chop fest that maybe went on a little longer than it needed to. You can't win with wrestling fans. What one person likes, someone else hates.

[Raging Justice]

So I'm just now checking the Backlash results to see if anything interesting happened

It looks like damage control is a joke now, they have already jobbed out Dakota Kai twice I believe since making her the leader of the group. On top of that they now have no titles. Pretty much anytime anyone is booked into a match with Bianca Belair, you can expect them to lose. Miss "I play with my hair like a child" may be the most protected woman on WWE's roster, even more so than Rhea Ripley. It looks like we can expect Jade Cargill to get the same treatment. I feel bad for the joshis, they never get this kind of treatment. I regularly hear people complain online about Asuka's short title reigns or the fact that she never gets to win a match at a Wrestlemania



I really hate WWE right now. Aside from maybe NXT, which still occasionally grabs my attention, their product sucks. I think the nice thing about NXT is that it doesn't have these chosen few who always get the best pushes and booking. Like, you actually have a CHANCE of making a name for yourself in NXT. Not so on Raw or Smackdown, it's always the same people at the top. Bianca Belair, Cody Rhodes, you can now add Jade Cargill to that list. Jade is basically getting the Cody Rhodes treatment because she was a big deal in AEW (though to this day I have no idea why). A guy like Swerve Strickland would never make it in WWE. LA Knight is proof positive of that. WWE doesn't CARE if you get over and if you're deserving, they push who they want to push and are very goddamn stubborn about it. Whether it's Vince or it's Triple H, this has not changed. It's the same WWE. Triple H is running the Vince McMahon playbook to a T. WWE is mainstream, corporate, watered down crap, and we can no longer blame Vince McMahon for that.

[Raging Justice]

So with Mina Shirakawa starting to get some exposure in ROH/AEW, and Tam Nakano being in that Supercard of Honor show, I'd like to see Unagi Sayaka at some point. She's a former Cosmic Angel like Mina Shirakawa. Nobody really knows why she's not in Stardom anymore. There's rumors she was fired or that she had issues with people there, but it's all hearsay. She's been doing great work as a freelancer and I think has even produced some of her own shows. She seems to dig the US too and has already made appearances here in other promotions:



She's definitely got a unique and interesting vibe to her. I've seen her described as an kabukimono, which I believe refers to a type of samurai that doesn't look, act, or dress like a traditional samurai.



She's also very...uh, easy on the eyes shall we say? Ahem...anyway

I'm a Cosmic Angel mark and that applies to former members as well as current and new members, I eventually want to see all these girls over here. They're actually becoming a fairly large faction, particularly if you add in the part timers known as "Colors" and the occasional honorary member, which I think one could have said about Kairi. Here's hoping they add Starlight Kid, who supposedly is the top merch seller along with Tam Nakano and Natsupoi. Putting her in the same group as those two makes a certain amount of sense.

[Reprise]

I didn't watch Backlash yesterday. The problem I have with WWE's international events lately, is I keep hearing how amazing the shows are and how the crowds make them, which perhaps is true, but they just always look so mediocre on paper (edit: Clash at the Castle was really good though). I mean, what of importance actually happened? What matches were actually interesting either from a technical standpoint or storyline? Last year's Backlash and this year's just have "B event" written all over them.

Meanwhile, you have AEW whose "B event" just resulted in a a new world champion in Swerve and had incredible dream matches like Bryan Danielson vs Ospreay and nearly every match could have gone either way, bar a couple. Whereas, I think I predicted the outcome of every single Backlash match.

I caught up with Dynamite yesterday and it was a fun episode. Didn't have time for Rampage, but I might watch it tonight or later this week.

[Raging Justice]

I didn't watch Backlash yesterday. The problem I have with WWE's international events lately, is I keep hearing how amazing the shows are and how the crowds make them, which perhaps is true, but they just always look so mediocre on paper (edit: Clash at the Castle was really good though). I mean, what of importance actually happened? What matches were actually interesting either from a technical standpoint or storyline? Last year's Backlash and this year's just have "B event" written all over them.

Meanwhile, you have AEW whose "B event" just resulted in a a new world champion in Swerve and had incredible dream matches like Bryan Danielson vs Ospreay and nearly every match could have gone either way, bar a couple. Whereas, I think I predicted the outcome of every single Backlash match.

I caught up with Dynamite yesterday and it was a fun episode. Didn't have time for Rampage, but I might watch it tonight or later this week.

Some have complained about how AEW doesn't have consistency with their booking or creative. That has been true, though I think they are improving in those areas. Here's the funny thing though, that chaotic element of AEW has an upside. That upside is that anyone can get a big push at any time. AEW is more fluid with their booking than WWE. It's like, "Damn, this Swerve guy is killing it. Hey, the crowds are starting to really get into him. Hmmm, what if we put him in a program with Hangman. Let's see what comes of that. Holy shit! Him and Hangman have both come out of this better then they were going into it. Let's throw Samoa Joe into the mix. Holy shit! This is gold...maybe we should strap Swerve. Joe has had a good run"

WWE on the other hand is like, "PUSH CODY RHODES AT ALL COSTS NO MATTER WHAT!!! BIANCA BELAIR MUST NEVER LOSE A MATCH!!!! JADE CARGILL MUST GET BROCK LESNAR TREATMENT!!!"

Random person - "Goddamn, this LA Knight is really getting over"

WWE - "FUCK LA KNIGHT!!! PUSH CODY RHODES AT ALL COSTS NO MATTER WHAT!!!"

Random person - "We just made Dakota Kai the leader of Damage Control. She is getting some serious TV time now and has been doing impressive promos. Maybe we'll let her get a win over Bianca to give her some real credibility, it's not like it's gonna hurt Bianca to lose ONE match"

WWE - "FUCK DAKOTA KAI!!! NO ONE BEATS BIANCA BELAIR OR JADE CARGILL!!! DAKOTA KAI IS GETTING PINNED IN HER NEXT MATCH AND YOU'RE FIRED!!!"

Random person - "We have these other talented people on the roster..."

WWE - "SHUT UP!!! CODY RHODES!!! BIANCA BELAIR!!! JADE CARGILL!!!"

On top of that, WWE is getting into a bad habit of really long title reigns too...which just adds to the stagnant feeling of their product. It's pretty much a lock that Cody will be champ until next year's Mania, unless he gets injured or something. We all know that every match and feud he has until then (like him and AJ Styles at Backlash) is just pointless and a waste of everyone's time. WWE is a TV series where literally everything is spelled out for you in advance and there are NO plot twists or surprises at all.